HECnet

hecnet@lists.dfupdate.se

6 participants
15552 discussions

by R.Voorhorst＠swabhawat.com

Yes I can provide that but we must see where to put it; maybe temporarily on Swbv55 as that one is usually active on hecnet or I will create a Tops10 node linked to Swbv55 with a sync line. Remember though, Anf10 has a limitation of 64 nodes including DN200's, so there is a limit. -----Original Message----- From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Peter Lothberg Sent: Wednesday, 17 November, 2021 01:02 To: hecnet <hecnet at Update.UU.SE> Subject: Re: [HECnet] ANF10 network --> Anf10 KL<>KS + DN200 --> DN200/DN20 parameters Reindert, can you put the DN200 complete package up for grabs? Ad se can have an "infinite number" of virtual dn200's to link the systems together, this might be the best thing for a HECanf10 before Paul writes a perl version -:) --P ----- Original Message ----- > From: "R. Voorhorst" <R.Voorhorst at swabhawat.com> > To: "hecnet" <hecnet at Update.UU.SE> > Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2021 6:36:02 PM > Subject: RE: [HECnet] ANF10 network --> Anf10 KL<>KS + DN200 --> > DN200/DN20 parameters > The DN200/DN20 actually supports 5 Dmc class sync lines with some > limitations with number of buffers per line; the system is unmapped > i.e. only 28 kW available and only 5 concurrent sync lines of one > class will fit comfortably within an otherwise maxed combination of terminal lines and peripherals. > I use the Dmc's for that as they will communicate with every class of > sync interfaces, so with Dups as well. > Mixed varieties of sync lines diminish the max achievable active > number of lines. > Theoretically one can have more lines per controller and more > controllers, but memory constrains what will work. I have not tried > Dup's yet for exceeding the pseudo standard of 2 lines. > > Reindert

3 years

ANF10 network --> Anf10 KL<>KS + DN200 --> patches

by R.Voorhorst＠swabhawat.com

Yes, I will collect them and make them available and it is for 8 dups. You can then choose how many you actually have active. Decnet supports up to 8 circuits/lines. Reindert -----Original Message----- From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Peter Lothberg Sent: Wednesday, 17 November, 2021 00:02 To: hecnet <hecnet at Update.UU.SE> Subject: Re: [HECnet] ANF10 network --> Anf10 KL<>KS + DN200 Reindert, Would you share the patches to Tops10/simh to support the 4 DUP-11's? -P ----- Original Message ----- > From: "R. Voorhorst" <R.Voorhorst at swabhawat.com> > To: "hecnet" <hecnet at Update.UU.SE> > Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2021 5:15:00 PM > Subject: RE: [HECnet] ANF10 network --> Anf10 KL<>KS + DN200 > L.S. > > Anf10 ethernet and sync lines are 2 separate domains and currently > there are no standard interconnections. > The (now late) Johnny Ericsson had an Anf10 tunnel but I never tried it. > On a KL10 with dte interface a certain routing should be possible, but > that cannot yet be done I also restored a DN200 Pdp11 simh workstation > (see Anfu63) with terminals and peripherals with remote printing, > plotting etc. > The network looks like this from the multi kdp/dup node with 2 decnet > and 2 > anf10 active: > > > .net/t > [ANF10 network: connected to ANFW08(57), located at ANFW08(57), 5 nodes] > Node ANFW04 (53) 77(8), 55(8), 54(8) > Node ANFW05 (54) 77(8), 53(8) > Node ANFW06 (55) 77(8), 53(8) > Node ANFW08 (57) 77(10) > Node ANFU63 (77) 53(6), 54(6), 55(6), 57(6) > > [DECnet network: local node SWBW08, 8 reachable nodes in area 63] > Name Number Line Cost Hops L.Links Delay > SWBC01 (63.50) KDP-0-0 7 1 > SWBV89 (63.89) KDP-0-0 7 1 > SWBW01 (63.51) KDP-0-0 11 2 > SWBW04 (63.54) KDP-0-0 12 2 > SWBW05 (63.55) KDP-0-1 7 1 > SWBW06 (63.56) KDP-0-0 12 2 > SWBW08 (63.58) local 0 0 0 5000 > SWBX01 (63.41) KDP-0-0 11 2 > > .net > [ANF10 network: connected to ANFW08(57), located at ANFW08(57), 5 nodes] > Node ANFW04 (53) Swbw04 Tops10-7.07/34201 01-aug-20 > Node ANFW05 (54) Swbw05 Tops10-7.07/34201 01-aug-20 > Node ANFW06 (55) Swbw06 Tops10-7.07/34201 16-jul-20 > Node ANFW08 (57) SwbW08 Tops10-7.06/34100 27-Jul-20 > Node ANFU63 (77) DN200 V25(244) 02-Aug-89 > > [DECnet network: local node SWBW08, 8 reachable nodes in area 63] > SWBC01 SWBV89 SWBW01 SWBW04 SWBW05 SWBW06 SWBW08 SWBX01 > > Reindert

3 years

ANF10 network --> Anf10 KL<>KS + DN200

by R.Voorhorst＠swabhawat.com

L.S. Anf10 ethernet and sync lines are 2 separate domains and currently there are no standard interconnections. The (now late) Johnny Ericsson had an Anf10 tunnel but I never tried it. On a KL10 with dte interface a certain routing should be possible, but that cannot yet be done I also restored a DN200 Pdp11 simh workstation (see Anfu63) with terminals and peripherals with remote printing, plotting etc. The network looks like this from the multi kdp/dup node with 2 decnet and 2 anf10 active: .net/t [ANF10 network: connected to ANFW08(57), located at ANFW08(57), 5 nodes] Node ANFW04 (53) 77(8), 55(8), 54(8) Node ANFW05 (54) 77(8), 53(8) Node ANFW06 (55) 77(8), 53(8) Node ANFW08 (57) 77(10) Node ANFU63 (77) 53(6), 54(6), 55(6), 57(6) [DECnet network: local node SWBW08, 8 reachable nodes in area 63] Name Number Line Cost Hops L.Links Delay SWBC01 (63.50) KDP-0-0 7 1 SWBV89 (63.89) KDP-0-0 7 1 SWBW01 (63.51) KDP-0-0 11 2 SWBW04 (63.54) KDP-0-0 12 2 SWBW05 (63.55) KDP-0-1 7 1 SWBW06 (63.56) KDP-0-0 12 2 SWBW08 (63.58) local 0 0 0 5000 SWBX01 (63.41) KDP-0-0 11 2 .net [ANF10 network: connected to ANFW08(57), located at ANFW08(57), 5 nodes] Node ANFW04 (53) Swbw04 Tops10-7.07/34201 01-aug-20 Node ANFW05 (54) Swbw05 Tops10-7.07/34201 01-aug-20 Node ANFW06 (55) Swbw06 Tops10-7.07/34201 16-jul-20 Node ANFW08 (57) SwbW08 Tops10-7.06/34100 27-Jul-20 Node ANFU63 (77) DN200 V25(244) 02-Aug-89 [DECnet network: local node SWBW08, 8 reachable nodes in area 63] SWBC01 SWBV89 SWBW01 SWBW04 SWBW05 SWBW06 SWBW08 SWBX01 Reindert -----Original Message----- From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of G. Sent: Tuesday, 16 November, 2021 21:36 To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE Subject: Re: [HECnet] ANF10 network > It was not full mesh. ANF10 has routing with metrics like DECnet and > RDH even wrote a driver to talk over Ethernet between KL's. If anyone is curious, here below is a link to the ANF-to-Ethernet code by RDH. It contains some nice explanation too :) http://pdp-10.trailing-edge.com/bb-jr93k-bb/01/10,7/mon/d8eint.mac.html G.

3 years

LSSM group visit today

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

LSSM hosted a CompSci class from Carnegie-Mellon University today, a for-credit class trip and project. They all learned the Forth language, rather well I might add, and wrote their own demos, on one of our PDP-11/70s. Here are some pics: http://www.neurotica.com/misc/LSSM-CMU-2021/20211115_152707.jpg http://www.neurotica.com/misc/LSSM-CMU-2021/20211115_152757.jpg http://www.neurotica.com/misc/LSSM-CMU-2021/20211115_154319_03.jpg http://www.neurotica.com/misc/LSSM-CMU-2021/20211115_154355_01.jpg http://www.neurotica.com/misc/LSSM-CMU-2021/20211115_154451.jpg The 11/70 isn't pictured, but you all know what those look like. It's the one on the Wikipedia "PDP-11" page, though that's a very old picture from when it was at my home. (please excuse the falling front window sign, it's disintegrating and we're awaiting its replacement) I mention this here in case anyone is interested, and the machine, FANG::, is on HECnet whenever it's running. (which is my tenuous link to "on-topic") -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA

3 years

ANF10 network --> Kdp/Dup

by R.Voorhorst＠swabhawat.com

L.S. It is quite easy to expand this; currently I run 8 lines from the Kdp/dup and it works quite well. It needs a slight adaptation in Simh and another in Tops10, but you have to rebuild the monitor. Reindert From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Robert Armstrong Sent: Tuesday, 16 November, 2021 17:34 To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE Subject: [HECnet] ANF10 network Supratim and I (with some help and encouragement from Peter) have set up an ANF10 network between the TOPS10 nodes VENTI and TWONKY. If you haven't heard of it, ANF10 (short for "A Networking Feature" - yes, really!) predates DECnet (I'm pretty sure, although I'm sure there will be debate about that) and provides mostly the same functions - remote terminals, file transfer, etc. ANF10 also has remote RJEs with card readers, line printers and terminal concentrators. .net/anf [ANF10 network: connected to VENTI(20), located at VENTI(20), 2 nodes] Node VENTI (20) SIMH KS10 VENTI 7.04 NET 14-Nov-21 Node TWONKY (37) SIMH KS10 TWONKY 7.04NET 15-Nov-21 It's possible to run ANF10 and DECnet both, and that's what we're doing so TWONKY and VENTI are also available on HECnet. If anybody else has a TOPS10 system and would like to connect it would be nice to add a few more nodes, but there is a problem. TOPS10 supports a maximum of two KDP/DUP lines on the KS10, and you need one for DECnet and the other for ANF10. That means each system can talk to at most one other ANF10 system, which limits the network size to two nodes. Bummer. There are a few options available - * DEC made some DNxx PDP-11 boxes that supported multiple ANF10 connections. We could set up one of these as a router. * Somebody could hack TOPS10 to allow more than two DUP lines. * Somebody could write a pyDECnet type gizmo that speaks ANF10. And there might be others that I haven't thought of yet. Any ideas? Bob

3 years

DEfining HECnet node names on TOPS-10

by bob＠jfcl.com

Johnny's FIX.T20 HECnet node list works on TOPS-10 as well (same NCP, same commands), BUT there's an issue. What you'd really like to do is to put something like "TAKE HECNET.CMD" inside of [1,4]SYSTEM.CMD. The latter is executed automatically at boot time and this would let you define all HECnet nodes when you start up. However OPR (at least the version with TOPS-10 7.04) doesn't allow nested TAKE commands, so the "TAKE HECNET." inside of SYSTEM.CMD fails. Has somebody figured out a trick to get around this? Bob

3 years

Tops-20 Terminal Buffers?

by tommytimesharing＠gmail.com

I was doing some more Kermit-20 measurements while I continue to debug the NRT code. Again, the fastest transfer rate that I could get out of a loopback pseudo-terminal connection was 129.16 KBps with a packet size of 140 characters (note previous post was in baud) .? Since this is not going outside of the PDP-10, one assumes that it would either be the top speed possible or near it as we are just talking shuttling data between buffers. I did a transfer of the same file to an iMac and was /very/ surprised to find that I got 4,000 byte packet size and a transfer rate 151.78 KBps.? That's right, using the NI resulted in a speed _increase_ of 17%.? I instrumented Kermit to report the allocated monitor buffers by line type and got the table below from various sign ons, viz: ? TTY line Type:?? FE?? PTY? NRT? TVT? CTM ? Input Buffers:??? 1??? 1??? 1??? 1??? 1 ? Output Buffers:?? 2??? 1??? 2??? 4??? 2 The abbreviations are as follows: * ?FE, Front End (RSX-20F) terminal (there is only one, CTY) * PTY, Pseudo-terminal * NRT, DECnet Network Remote Terminal * TVT, Internet Telnet Virtual Terminal * CTM, DECnet CTERM (I forget what CTERM abbreviates to) * LAT, Local Area Terminal (I don't currently have a working transport and client for this) So what we can see is that a TVT has four _times_ the buffers to play with than the PTY.? I don't currently know how large a terminal buffer is nor what else this might mean, but it is suggestive. For what it's worth, I also did comparison with FTP.? A data transfer in the RFC959 paradigm is acknowledged on the control channel with return code of 226.? There are no acknowledgements of the data channel; it's a straight fire hose.? As I expected, an FTP transfer blew Kermit right out of the water.? For the same sized file, the 20 measured an upload data rate of 1.09 *M*Bps with a 10 microsecond resolution (from first network write to return from closing the transfer 'socket').? The iMac measured 1.25 *M*Bps download. So it would appear that an FTP transfer is about 7.38 times faster, which is of interest, but otherwise perhaps irrelevant as they are not even remotely doing the same thing.? One expects the same result for DAP, once I get FTP up on that transport.? Again, we're not comparing apples to apples.

3 years

Multiple nodes failing NICE in the same way

by paulkoning＠comcast.net

My network scanner is getting very strange responses from three different nodes all misbehaving the same way: CAIR, MAGPIE, and FARGO. What I see is: 1. The connection to object 19 (NICE, the network management listener) is accepted, but the version number that is supposed to be sent as part of the accept is missing. 2. When I send a NICE request to the node, I get back a message with this content: <28>Nov 12 20:35:16 dnetd[1688]: Cannot chdir to /nonexistent : No such file or directory\n\xff\x00\x00 All three nodes do this. Configuration error that just happens to exist on all three? paul

3 years

RSTS/E started emitting "?EVTLOG (BLDNIC) -- %Integer error" messages

by tony.nicholson＠computer.org

With the recent talk about the magic 9-Nov-2021 date affecting TOPS-10, I notice today that my RSTS/E V10.1 system has started putting out console messages - ?EVTLOG (BLDNIC) -- %Integer error I'm running this on my PiPDP-11 which uses the Oscar modified SIMH PDP11 11/70 emulation. It's 10-Nov-2021 in Australia! I'm running the Paul Koning's updated Y2K version of EVTLOG from https://github.com/pkoning2/decstuff/tree/master/decnete Any ideas? I've tried rebooting and the message appears after start-up has completed, and at shutdown when the date is set to 10-Nov-21 - but not when use yesterday's date 9-Nov-21 Tony -- Tony Nicholson <tony.nicholson at computer.org>

3 years

Another TOPS-10 DECnet problem

by bob＠jfcl.com

. not date related this time (or at least I don't think it is). Every time I boot TOPS-10 (7.04, KS10, simh) I get stopcode NTMNEC. The job running is NML and the user PC is 511522. This is a debug stopcode so the system keeps going. The manual says of NTMNEC - "Some routine took the non-skip return, but did not give an error code by calling NTExxx. This means that the program returned to top level and field NXERR was zero. Determine which routine is failing, and make the error return give an error code." Has anybody else seen this? Is there a patch? It's getting a bit annoying, not to mention that it keeps crash dumping. Thanks, Bob

3 years

Jump to page:

2024

2023

2022

2021

2020

2019

2018

2017

2016

2015

2014

2013

2012

2011

2010

2009

2008

HECnet