On Thu, Apr 4, 2013 at 5:08 PM, <Paul_Koning at dell.com> wrote:
On Apr 4, 2013, at 4:59 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote:
On 04/04/2013 04:45 PM, hvlems wrote:
No ethernet in '79, no phase IV. So a DU11?
Hmmmm. Does SIMH emulate that?
It doesn't look like it does. And I don't know that VMS ever supported that device, anyway. RSX did, but various other systems tended to stay away from it because of the high software overhead. I do know that VMS supports DMC-11 (or DMR-11, essentially the same at the driver level), and there is support for that in the in-development release of SIMH.
paul
Hello!
What a predicament. Cory you said you'd upload it someplace to make it
available for us to do stuff with. Okay where? How big is it, and what
is the magic to convince (or confuse) SIMH for the VAX to bring it up?
Dave now you did it, the yetis are rioting.
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8 at gmail.com
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."
On Apr 4, 2013, at 4:59 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote:
On 04/04/2013 04:45 PM, hvlems wrote:
No ethernet in '79, no phase IV. So a DU11?
Hmmmm. Does SIMH emulate that?
It doesn't look like it does. And I don't know that VMS ever supported that device, anyway. RSX did, but various other systems tended to stay away from it because of the high software overhead. I do know that VMS supports DMC-11 (or DMR-11, essentially the same at the driver level), and there is support for that in the in-development release of SIMH.
paul
On 04/04/2013 04:45 PM, hvlems wrote:
No ethernet in '79, no phase IV. So a DU11?
Hmmmm. Does SIMH emulate that?
------Origineel bericht------
Van: Cory Smelosky
Afzender: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Aan: hecnet at update.uu.se
Beantwoorden: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Onderwerp: [HECnet] VAX/VMS 1.50
Verzonden: 4 april 2013 22:31
Afternoon all,
I managed to get this to boot in SIMH with minimal effort. (Started
from VMS 3.x and then installed 1.5 with a bunch of devices disabled)
sim> b rp2
Loading boot code from vmb.exe
VAX/VMS Version 1.50 12-APR-1979 09:30
PLEASE ENTER DATE AND TIME (DD-MMM-YYYY HH:MM) 04-APR-2013 14:39
OPCOM, 4-APR-2013 14:39:06.22, LOGFILE INITIALIZED, OPERATOR=_OPA0:
$ !
$ ! VAX/VMS system startup - Release 1
$ !
$ SHOW TIME
4-APR-2013 14:39:06
$ SET NOVERIFY
%MOUNT-I-MOUNTED, CONSOLE mounted on _DXA1:
Login quotas - Interactive limit=64, Current interactive value=0
SYSTEM job terminated at 4-APR-2013 14:39:06.49
Accounting information:
Buffered I/O count: 139 Peak working set size: 98
Direct I/O count: 38 Peak virtual size: 110
Page faults: 287 Mounted volumes: 1
Elapsed CPU time: 0 00:00:00.12 Elapsed time: 0 00:00:00.26
Username: SYSTEM
Password:
Welcome to VAX/VMS Version 1.50
$ sh network
NETWORK UNAVAILABLE
What kind of networking could I get working on this? Pre-Phase-IV using
a device SIMH doesn't have emulation support for? ;)
I can upload this disk image if anyone wants it.
--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Experiments
On Apr 4, 2013, at 4:41 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote:
On 04/04/2013 04:35 PM, Gregg Levine wrote:
...
$ sh network
NETWORK UNAVAILABLE
What kind of networking could I get working on this? Pre-Phase-IV using a
device SIMH doesn't have emulation support for? ;)
I can upload this disk image if anyone wants it.
--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Experiments
Hello!
I am impressed. What device is this that SIMH does not emulate?
It might emulate all I'd need. I'm not sure what networking on VMS this old would have been like. I just need to find documentation of VAX/VMS 1.50. ;)
Given the release date shown in the login banner (1979) it's probably Phase III. Wikipedia says Phase III is from 1980, so it's possible that it's Phase II instead.
If Phase III, you could use the DMC-11 emulation in the current SIMH (discussed here recently), connected to something else that knows Phase III. If Phase II, it gets trickier, because you'd need a Phase III node for it to connect to, and it would presumably only know to talk to that neighbor node. (If it actually is Phase II, I'd be interested in a copy -- I've been working on Phase II compatibility for my DECnet/Python implementation.) At least I assume that the "routing" ("intercept") mechanism that's marginally documented in the Phase II specs isn't in DECnet/VMS if that's Phase II; some very vague memory says that this machinery only existed to allow 36 bit systems with Phase II in the OS to talk to an external node via their Phase II PDP-11 front end processors. I'd be interested if anyone can tell us more about that; I never paid any attention when I was actually working on DECnet back then.
paul
No ethernet in '79, no phase IV. So a DU11?
------Origineel bericht------
Van: Cory Smelosky
Afzender: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Aan: hecnet at update.uu.se
Beantwoorden: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Onderwerp: [HECnet] VAX/VMS 1.50
Verzonden: 4 april 2013 22:31
Afternoon all,
I managed to get this to boot in SIMH with minimal effort. (Started
from VMS 3.x and then installed 1.5 with a bunch of devices disabled)
sim> b rp2
Loading boot code from vmb.exe
VAX/VMS Version 1.50 12-APR-1979 09:30
PLEASE ENTER DATE AND TIME (DD-MMM-YYYY HH:MM) 04-APR-2013 14:39
OPCOM, 4-APR-2013 14:39:06.22, LOGFILE INITIALIZED, OPERATOR=_OPA0:
$ !
$ ! VAX/VMS system startup - Release 1
$ !
$ SHOW TIME
4-APR-2013 14:39:06
$ SET NOVERIFY
%MOUNT-I-MOUNTED, CONSOLE mounted on _DXA1:
Login quotas - Interactive limit=64, Current interactive value=0
SYSTEM job terminated at 4-APR-2013 14:39:06.49
Accounting information:
Buffered I/O count: 139 Peak working set size: 98
Direct I/O count: 38 Peak virtual size: 110
Page faults: 287 Mounted volumes: 1
Elapsed CPU time: 0 00:00:00.12 Elapsed time: 0 00:00:00.26
Username: SYSTEM
Password:
Welcome to VAX/VMS Version 1.50
$ sh network
NETWORK UNAVAILABLE
What kind of networking could I get working on this? Pre-Phase-IV using
a device SIMH doesn't have emulation support for? ;)
I can upload this disk image if anyone wants it.
--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Experiments
On 04/04/2013 04:35 PM, Gregg Levine wrote:
On Thu, Apr 4, 2013 at 4:31 PM, Cory Smelosky <b4 at gewt.net> wrote:
Afternoon all,
I managed to get this to boot in SIMH with minimal effort. (Started from
VMS 3.x and then installed 1.5 with a bunch of devices disabled)
sim> b rp2
Loading boot code from vmb.exe
VAX/VMS Version 1.50 12-APR-1979 09:30
PLEASE ENTER DATE AND TIME (DD-MMM-YYYY HH:MM) 04-APR-2013 14:39
OPCOM, 4-APR-2013 14:39:06.22, LOGFILE INITIALIZED, OPERATOR=_OPA0:
$ !
$ ! VAX/VMS system startup - Release 1
$ !
$ SHOW TIME
4-APR-2013 14:39:06
$ SET NOVERIFY
%MOUNT-I-MOUNTED, CONSOLE mounted on _DXA1:
Login quotas - Interactive limit=64, Current interactive value=0
SYSTEM job terminated at 4-APR-2013 14:39:06.49
Accounting information:
Buffered I/O count: 139 Peak working set size: 98
Direct I/O count: 38 Peak virtual size: 110
Page faults: 287 Mounted volumes: 1
Elapsed CPU time: 0 00:00:00.12 Elapsed time: 0 00:00:00.26
Username: SYSTEM
Password:
Welcome to VAX/VMS Version 1.50
$ sh network
NETWORK UNAVAILABLE
What kind of networking could I get working on this? Pre-Phase-IV using a
device SIMH doesn't have emulation support for? ;)
I can upload this disk image if anyone wants it.
--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Experiments
Hello!
I am impressed. What device is this that SIMH does not emulate?
It might emulate all I'd need. I'm not sure what networking on VMS this old would have been like. I just need to find documentation of VAX/VMS 1.50. ;)
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8 at gmail.com
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."
--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Experiments
On Thu, Apr 4, 2013 at 4:31 PM, Cory Smelosky <b4 at gewt.net> wrote:
Afternoon all,
I managed to get this to boot in SIMH with minimal effort. (Started from
VMS 3.x and then installed 1.5 with a bunch of devices disabled)
sim> b rp2
Loading boot code from vmb.exe
VAX/VMS Version 1.50 12-APR-1979 09:30
PLEASE ENTER DATE AND TIME (DD-MMM-YYYY HH:MM) 04-APR-2013 14:39
OPCOM, 4-APR-2013 14:39:06.22, LOGFILE INITIALIZED, OPERATOR=_OPA0:
$ !
$ ! VAX/VMS system startup - Release 1
$ !
$ SHOW TIME
4-APR-2013 14:39:06
$ SET NOVERIFY
%MOUNT-I-MOUNTED, CONSOLE mounted on _DXA1:
Login quotas - Interactive limit=64, Current interactive value=0
SYSTEM job terminated at 4-APR-2013 14:39:06.49
Accounting information:
Buffered I/O count: 139 Peak working set size: 98
Direct I/O count: 38 Peak virtual size: 110
Page faults: 287 Mounted volumes: 1
Elapsed CPU time: 0 00:00:00.12 Elapsed time: 0 00:00:00.26
Username: SYSTEM
Password:
Welcome to VAX/VMS Version 1.50
$ sh network
NETWORK UNAVAILABLE
What kind of networking could I get working on this? Pre-Phase-IV using a
device SIMH doesn't have emulation support for? ;)
I can upload this disk image if anyone wants it.
--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Experiments
Hello!
I am impressed. What device is this that SIMH does not emulate?
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8 at gmail.com
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."
Afternoon all,
I managed to get this to boot in SIMH with minimal effort. (Started from VMS 3.x and then installed 1.5 with a bunch of devices disabled)
sim> b rp2
Loading boot code from vmb.exe
VAX/VMS Version 1.50 12-APR-1979 09:30
PLEASE ENTER DATE AND TIME (DD-MMM-YYYY HH:MM) 04-APR-2013 14:39
OPCOM, 4-APR-2013 14:39:06.22, LOGFILE INITIALIZED, OPERATOR=_OPA0:
$ !
$ ! VAX/VMS system startup - Release 1
$ !
$ SHOW TIME
4-APR-2013 14:39:06
$ SET NOVERIFY
%MOUNT-I-MOUNTED, CONSOLE mounted on _DXA1:
Login quotas - Interactive limit=64, Current interactive value=0
SYSTEM job terminated at 4-APR-2013 14:39:06.49
Accounting information:
Buffered I/O count: 139 Peak working set size: 98
Direct I/O count: 38 Peak virtual size: 110
Page faults: 287 Mounted volumes: 1
Elapsed CPU time: 0 00:00:00.12 Elapsed time: 0 00:00:00.26
Username: SYSTEM
Password:
Welcome to VAX/VMS Version 1.50
$ sh network
NETWORK UNAVAILABLE
What kind of networking could I get working on this? Pre-Phase-IV using a device SIMH doesn't have emulation support for? ;)
I can upload this disk image if anyone wants it.
--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Experiments
Looks like someone tried and failed (from 8.403). If you want to try again please use a packet sniffer and send me the data.
Thanks
Rob
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Rob Jarratt Sent: 04 April 2013 06:22 To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE Subject: RE: [HECnet] Who was doing that HECnet mapping work?
I am back online now. SHOW ADJ NODES won t work yet. You may fail to get a connection for SHOW KNOWN CIRCUITS, that is my next task to fix.
Regards
Rob
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Brian Hechinger Sent: 04 April 2013 01:35 To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE Subject: Re: [HECnet] Who was doing that HECnet mapping work?
That was me. I haven't touched that code in a while but I should go take a look at it again. It used SHOW KNOWN CIRCUITS and SHOW ADJ NODES. Let me know when you're back online and I'll play with that some more. -brian On 4/3/2013 6:55 PM, Rob Jarratt wrote:
A while ago there was discussion of a program or DCL script that was automating the creation of a map of HECnet. It stumbled when it came to my user mode router because it did not implement NICE. Well, I have been doing some work to rectify that. The work is far from complete, but under the right circumstances and with a fair wind you can get A5RTR to tell you the output of SHOW KNOWN CIRCUITS.
Who was doing that work, and which commands needed to be supported for the program/script to work?
Regards
Rob
NB A5RTR is not on HECnet at the moment because I have had a change of IP address and I am waiting for Johnny to tell his bridge to re-read its config.
Someone did though, from 8.403 by the looks of it. If you do try though please use a packet sniffer and send me the data.
Thanks
Rob
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Brian Hechinger Sent: 04 April 2013 19:32 To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE Subject: Re: [HECnet] Who was doing that HECnet mapping work?
Actually, I hadn't tried. :) -brian On 4/4/2013 2:24 PM, Rob Jarratt wrote:
I see you tried and it looks like you failed. I didn t have a packet sniffer running at the time so I can t see the exact reason it failed, but I think I know some things to look at. If you try again could you run a packet sniffer and send me the data?
Thanks
Rob
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Brian Hechinger Sent: 04 April 2013 01:35 To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE Subject: Re: [HECnet] Who was doing that HECnet mapping work?
That was me. I haven't touched that code in a while but I should go take a look at it again. It used SHOW KNOWN CIRCUITS and SHOW ADJ NODES. Let me know when you're back online and I'll play with that some more. -brian On 4/3/2013 6:55 PM, Rob Jarratt wrote:
A while ago there was discussion of a program or DCL script that was automating the creation of a map of HECnet. It stumbled when it came to my user mode router because it did not implement NICE. Well, I have been doing some work to rectify that. The work is far from complete, but under the right circumstances and with a fair wind you can get A5RTR to tell you the output of SHOW KNOWN CIRCUITS.
Who was doing that work, and which commands needed to be supported for the program/script to work?
Regards
Rob
NB A5RTR is not on HECnet at the moment because I have had a change of IP address and I am waiting for Johnny to tell his bridge to re-read its config.
