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Anyone got TOPS-20 / Ultrix with DECNET SIMH image ready to run?

by b4＠gewt.net

On Wed, 12 Jun 2013, Dave McGuire wrote: On 06/12/2013 02:33 PM, Paul_Koning at Dell.com wrote: ago. And that demo surfaced some time later. The big complaint was that when too many windows were open the system started dragging its feet. I blame X for that. ;) I still have that happen...on modern intel crap. X never did that on far, far slower hardware. X was pretty good even on very slow hardware, though the first VAXstation with its one bit per pixel dumb bitmap display was iffy. The VCB01. That was my first VAX framebuffer. I'd agree with "iffy" until you compare it with its contemporaries...i.e., CGA on a PeeCee. PeeCee contemporaries left much to be desired. ;) But it was far better than its predecessor (VAXwindows? I forgot what it was called -- a VMS-specific windowing system developed at DEC, and dumped after a year in favor of X. DECwindows. I loved it, but then I loved X more. =) (and still do!) -Dave Unfortunately X on modern OSes is a little more of a kludge. ;) I suppose if you tweak it enough and force it to bend over to serve you it can be quite nice...but It's not my friend. Much like many other UNIX/Linux apps...X DOES choose its friends very carefully. ;) (It's one of the few UNIX-HATERS chapters I completely agree with...I just think X has wasted potential and could've been better implemented.) -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA -- Cory Smelosky http://gewt.net/ Personal stuff http://gimme-sympathy.org Experiments

11 years, 11 months

Anyone got TOPS-20 / Ultrix with DECNET SIMH image ready to run?

by jg＠jordi.guillaumes.name

Just a very basic question: which kind of disk drive should I configure in simh to make the VAX Ultrix 4.5 happy? :) After that I will probably bomb you with questions about configuration and layered installation :) Jordi Guillaumes i Pons Barcelona - Catalunya - Europa El 12/06/2013, a les 20:37, Dave McGuire <mcguire at neurotica.com> va escriure: On 06/12/2013 02:30 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote: On Wed, 12 Jun 2013, Dave McGuire wrote: On 06/12/2013 01:53 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote: I would like to play with Ultrix too. I tried to install it some time ago and didn't succeed (no docs, a probably corrupted media image...). Are there viable media available somewhere? Docs? I have tape images for Ultrix/VAX v4.0. I have a physical CD for it as well, but possibly a later release, as well as one for MIPS, but I've not yet imaged them. I don't recall their release numbers because I haven't seen them in probably fifteen years, but I know what box they're in. I will try to dig them up soon. Docs...It's BSD UNIX, man! Yet the package management is partially SysV. ;) Package management?! By package management I mean: "using setld to install packages from tape". Oh wow, good old setld. Yes, I do remember that. It's so primitive that I didn't even think of it as "package management" in today's terms. Wait a minute. Was setld present in any SysV implementations? (Seriously, I ran Ultrix on my desktop for years, didn't even know it HAD package management...I built everything from source.) Like a real UNIX user! :) Well yes. ;) Thank you. ;) -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA

11 years, 11 months

Anyone got TOPS-20 / Ultrix with DECNET SIMH image ready to run?

by b4＠gewt.net

On Wed, 12 Jun 2013, Dave McGuire wrote: On 06/12/2013 02:30 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote: On Wed, 12 Jun 2013, Dave McGuire wrote: On 06/12/2013 01:53 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote: I would like to play with Ultrix too. I tried to install it some time ago and didn't succeed (no docs, a probably corrupted media image...). Are there viable media available somewhere? Docs? I have tape images for Ultrix/VAX v4.0. I have a physical CD for it as well, but possibly a later release, as well as one for MIPS, but I've not yet imaged them. I don't recall their release numbers because I haven't seen them in probably fifteen years, but I know what box they're in. I will try to dig them up soon. Docs...It's BSD UNIX, man! Yet the package management is partially SysV. ;) Package management?! By package management I mean: "using setld to install packages from tape". Oh wow, good old setld. Yes, I do remember that. It's so primitive that I didn't even think of it as "package management" in today's terms. I don't blame you. ;) Wait a minute. Was setld present in any SysV implementations? It was present in the x86 build of SVR4 iirc. I'd need to consult my disk image (http://gewt.net/sysv.img). (Seriously, I ran Ultrix on my desktop for years, didn't even know it HAD package management...I built everything from source.) Like a real UNIX user! :) Well yes. ;) Thank you. ;) Welcome! ;) -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA -- Cory Smelosky http://gewt.net/ Personal stuff http://gimme-sympathy.org Experiments

11 years, 11 months

Anyone got TOPS-20 / Ultrix with DECNET SIMH image ready to run?

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On 06/12/2013 02:33 PM, Paul_Koning at Dell.com wrote: ago. And that demo surfaced some time later. The big complaint was that when too many windows were open the system started dragging its feet. I blame X for that. ;) I still have that happen...on modern intel crap. X never did that on far, far slower hardware. X was pretty good even on very slow hardware, though the first VAXstation with its one bit per pixel dumb bitmap display was iffy. The VCB01. That was my first VAX framebuffer. I'd agree with "iffy" until you compare it with its contemporaries...i.e., CGA on a PeeCee. But it was far better than its predecessor (VAXwindows? I forgot what it was called -- a VMS-specific windowing system developed at DEC, and dumped after a year in favor of X. DECwindows. I loved it, but then I loved X more. =) (and still do!) -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA

11 years, 11 months

Anyone got TOPS-20 / Ultrix with DECNET SIMH image ready to run?

by clemc＠ccc.com

On Wed, Jun 12, 2013 at 1:53 PM, Cory Smelosky <b4 at gewt.net> wrote: Yet the package management is partially SysV. ;) Yikes what are describing/thinking? setld was the Ultrix/Tru64 installation/package manager and it was an creation of ZKO. Many (most of us maybe) that it was a #$%^ nightmare and had nothing to do with BSD or System V. I personally when on a small campaign in the late 1990s to kill setld and get them to use something closer to what the ISV were used too, but could never get the folks move.

11 years, 11 months

Anyone got TOPS-20 / Ultrix with DECNET SIMH image ready to run?

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On 06/12/2013 02:30 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote: On Wed, 12 Jun 2013, Dave McGuire wrote: On 06/12/2013 01:53 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote: I would like to play with Ultrix too. I tried to install it some time ago and didn't succeed (no docs, a probably corrupted media image...). Are there viable media available somewhere? Docs? I have tape images for Ultrix/VAX v4.0. I have a physical CD for it as well, but possibly a later release, as well as one for MIPS, but I've not yet imaged them. I don't recall their release numbers because I haven't seen them in probably fifteen years, but I know what box they're in. I will try to dig them up soon. Docs...It's BSD UNIX, man! Yet the package management is partially SysV. ;) Package management?! By package management I mean: "using setld to install packages from tape". Oh wow, good old setld. Yes, I do remember that. It's so primitive that I didn't even think of it as "package management" in today's terms. Wait a minute. Was setld present in any SysV implementations? (Seriously, I ran Ultrix on my desktop for years, didn't even know it HAD package management...I built everything from source.) Like a real UNIX user! :) Well yes. ;) Thank you. ;) -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA

11 years, 11 months

Anyone got TOPS-20 / Ultrix with DECNET SIMH image ready to run?

by Paul_Koning＠Dell.com

On Jun 12, 2013, at 2:19 PM, Dave McGuire wrote: On 06/12/2013 02:03 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote: I remember discussing with a DEC sales 'droid regarding a supposed non Intel running variety of Windows that was coming really soon now. It was supposed to become Windows NT. The first release was on an Alpha. Not the blue skinned variety of machines, but the classic white box one as demo. That came about as I was studying a MIPS based workstation running Ultrix on it. And remember this was at UNIX World a really long time ago. And that demo surfaced some time later. The big complaint was that when too many windows were open the system started dragging its feet. I blame X for that. ;) I still have that happen...on modern intel crap. X never did that on far, far slower hardware. X was pretty good even on very slow hardware, though the first VAXstation with its one bit per pixel dumb bitmap display was iffy. But it was far better than its predecessor (VAXwindows? I forgot what it was called -- a VMS-specific windowing system developed at DEC, and dumped after a year in favor of X. paul

11 years, 11 months

Anyone got TOPS-20 / Ultrix with DECNET SIMH image ready to run?

by b4＠gewt.net

On Wed, 12 Jun 2013, Sampsa Laine wrote: Still, anybody know of the 'correct' way of installing UUCP on this? It seems quite clever, it configured sendmail to deal with mail-11 in and out, I figured if I use the 'official' packages to install UUCP, it'll do the same. Should be on the tape. Not sure which tape, but it should be on said tape. But I'm an optimist. sampsa <sampsa at mac.com> mobile +961 788 10537 On 12 Jun 2013, at 20:19, Dave McGuire <mcguire at neurotica.com> wrote: On 06/12/2013 02:03 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote: I remember discussing with a DEC sales 'droid regarding a supposed non Intel running variety of Windows that was coming really soon now. It was supposed to become Windows NT. The first release was on an Alpha. Not the blue skinned variety of machines, but the classic white box one as demo. That came about as I was studying a MIPS based workstation running Ultrix on it. And remember this was at UNIX World a really long time ago. And that demo surfaced some time later. The big complaint was that when too many windows were open the system started dragging its feet. I blame X for that. ;) I still have that happen...on modern intel crap. X never did that on far, far slower hardware. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA -- Cory Smelosky http://gewt.net/ Personal stuff http://gimme-sympathy.org Experiments

11 years, 11 months

Anyone got TOPS-20 / Ultrix with DECNET SIMH image ready to run?

by b4＠gewt.net

On Wed, 12 Jun 2013, Dave McGuire wrote: On 06/12/2013 01:53 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote: I would like to play with Ultrix too. I tried to install it some time ago and didn't succeed (no docs, a probably corrupted media image...). Are there viable media available somewhere? Docs? I have tape images for Ultrix/VAX v4.0. I have a physical CD for it as well, but possibly a later release, as well as one for MIPS, but I've not yet imaged them. I don't recall their release numbers because I haven't seen them in probably fifteen years, but I know what box they're in. I will try to dig them up soon. Docs...It's BSD UNIX, man! Yet the package management is partially SysV. ;) Package management?! By package management I mean: "using setld to install packages from tape". (Seriously, I ran Ultrix on my desktop for years, didn't even know it HAD package management...I built everything from source.) Like a real UNIX user! :) -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA -- Cory Smelosky http://gewt.net/ Personal stuff http://gimme-sympathy.org Experiments

11 years, 11 months

Anyone got TOPS-20 / Ultrix with DECNET SIMH image ready to run?

by sampsa＠mac.com

Still, anybody know of the 'correct' way of installing UUCP on this? It seems quite clever, it configured sendmail to deal with mail-11 in and out, I figured if I use the 'official' packages to install UUCP, it'll do the same. But I'm an optimist. sampsa <sampsa at mac.com> mobile +961 788 10537 On 12 Jun 2013, at 20:19, Dave McGuire <mcguire at neurotica.com> wrote: On 06/12/2013 02:03 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote: I remember discussing with a DEC sales 'droid regarding a supposed non Intel running variety of Windows that was coming really soon now. It was supposed to become Windows NT. The first release was on an Alpha. Not the blue skinned variety of machines, but the classic white box one as demo. That came about as I was studying a MIPS based workstation running Ultrix on it. And remember this was at UNIX World a really long time ago. And that demo surfaced some time later. The big complaint was that when too many windows were open the system started dragging its feet. I blame X for that. ;) I still have that happen...on modern intel crap. X never did that on far, far slower hardware. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA

11 years, 11 months

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