HECnet

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15559 discussions

by system＠TMESIS.COM

Cory Smelosky <b4 at gewt.net> writes: On Wed, 2 Oct 2013, Dave McGuire wrote: On 10/02/2013 06:57 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote: Write it directly. Backup can do that right? I don't have to right disk images to disk in VMS too often. ;) No. This is what I've done to write tape images to tapes: $ INIT/ERASE MUA0: "" $ MOUNT/FOREIGN/BLOCK=512 MUA0: $ COPY <filename> MUA0: $ DISMOUNT/UNLOAD MUA0: Can anyone (Brian S?) say if this will work with disk as the destination device as well? I'd guess yes, but I haven't done it myself, at least not recently enough that I remember. -Dave Crap. My only good disk (the quantum was DEAD++ it seems) is just about 60M too small. Which is weird as the drive says it's 2G despite on the casing. Meaning I can either copy the files off manually to a blank disk...or I can stick with VMS 6.3 instead of 7.3. ;) ALl of VMS, even V7.3, fit on a single CD. That 600MB, give or take, and should easily fit on a 1GB drive. So, if yours truly is a 2GB drive, more is at work here. -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG Well I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.

11 years, 8 months

OpenVMS on VAXstation 4000/60

by system＠TMESIS.COM

Dave McGuire <mcguire at neurotica.com> writes: On 10/02/2013 06:57 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote: Write it directly. Backup can do that right? I don't have to right disk images to disk in VMS too often. ;) No. This is what I've done to write tape images to tapes: $ INIT/ERASE MUA0: "" $ MOUNT/FOREIGN/BLOCK=512 MUA0: $ COPY <filename> MUA0: $ DISMOUNT/UNLOAD MUA0: Can anyone (Brian S?) say if this will work with disk as the destination device as well? I'd guess yes, but I haven't done it myself, at least not recently enough that I remember. Destination being a disk? Yes. $ MOUNT/FOREIGN DUA0: $ COPY <filename> DUA0: $ DISMOUNT DUA0: $ MOUNT [/OVERRIDE=IDENTIFICATION] [/SYSTEM] DUA0: [label] The [] items are optional depending upon what you will do with the drive after writing the image to it. -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG Well I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.

11 years, 8 months

SIMH/VAX "temporary VMS cluster" for satellite installation notes

by jg＠jordi.guillaumes.name

El 03/10/2013, a les 1:37, Ryan Blair <blairrya at cse.msu.edu> va escriure: Since this has come up a few times as a recommendation (but without details on how to do it), I figured I'd provide my [really terse and unclean] notes on how to set up a SIMH/VAX image you can use to temporarily satellite boot VAXen into a cluster just to lay a fresh copy of VMS down onto them (and then on reboot have the targets be standalone machines). Please let me know if you have suggestions for cleaning this up! I'd love feedback for this. (...) ### installing VMS from a remote CD on a satellite-booted node: $ mount/over=id $1$dua3: (that's $ALLOCLASS$REMOTEDEVICE:) $ MOUNT/FOREIGN DUA0: $ backup $1$dua3:[000000]vms073.b/save_set dua0:/init /image/verify/list $ DISMOUNT DUA0: $ MOUNT/OVER=ID DUA0: $ COPY $1$dua3:[000000]vms073.* DUA0:[000000] ### if you want DECWindows you'll need DECW073.* too $ DISMOUNT DUA0: $ @SYS$SYSTEM:SHUTDOWN (make sure to pick REMOVE_NODE) SET BOOT DUA0: BOOT These download services are typically implemented using the host-based InfoServer support. ### END Wouldn't it be easier to use the "CREATE a duplicate system disk for XXXXX" of the config_cluster menu once you have setup the satellite? I mean, you could have a "clean" VMS install in a simh simulated VAX configured as a cluster boot server, then simply add any new machine as a satellite, configure the satelite so its own disk is visible from the boot node and then copy the clean system disk over the new machine. After that it is just question of updating MODPARAMS.DAT with the identifiers for your new system (and making it stand-alone if you don't want it to be clustered), clean up and initialize the DECNET databases and you will be done... Jordi Guillaumes i Pons jg at jordi.guillaumes.name HECnet: BITXOV::JGUILLAUMES

11 years, 8 months

VT-62?

by e.olofsen＠xs4all.nl

One more note on Emacs and alternatives... Emacs 19.28 compiled on my Alpha with VMS 6.1. On my VAX I only have gcc 2.8.1, and after lots of trouble and batch time, I gave up. Having lost SOS and EDT fluency, I had a look at JED. Interestingly, recent sources compile both on the old VAX as well as on CHIMPY. JED's author still keeps the VMS dependencies in the distribution, but untested only. Erik On Thu, Oct 03, 2013 at 12:09:38AM +0200, Johnny Billquist wrote: On 2013-10-02 23:59, Clem Cole wrote: On Wed, Oct 2, 2013 at 4:51 PM, Dave McGuire <mcguire at neurotica.com <mailto:mcguire at neurotica.com>> wrote: Emacs builds on most everything, and is packaged for most (all?) Linux distributions. Dave -- might want to tighten comment that a little. GNU-emacs builds on most anything with a 32 bit linear address space or greater. Other emacs implementations YMMV. In addition, a port of Emacs is actually not that trivial. Anyone familiar with TOPS-20 (or OS/8, or probably some other of DEC OSes) will probably recognize what I'm going to write next. Emacs "knows" how an executable looks like, and how the memory layout is of the running program, and how dynamic libraries work, and so on. Because, as a part of building emacs, emacs will start bare bone, read in all kind of initial lisp packages, compile stuff, and create a finalized emacs in memory that is running with all the bit and pieces of initialization code already run. At that point, emacs will do a memory dump to disk, and munge that file to be an executable. And that is the actual emacs binary. For any new system, and especially for any new binary image format, emacs needs to be taught all about it. But anyway, if the scope would be "emacs" and not "GNU emacs", then implementations exists for just about everything. I've written a small emacs-clone in TECO-8, there exists multiple Emacs clones for MS-DOS (maybe the best known is Epsilon). Stacken (the computer club at the Royal Institute of Technology) wrote an emacs clone called AMIS, which ran on VMS way back, as well as on Tops-10, RSTS/E, Norsk Data machines, and god knows what else. There is MicroEMACS, which is really easy to port around (I have it running on RSX). 2BSD have JOVE. I'm sure people can easily come up with other implementations... Johnny -- Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: bqt at softjar.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol

11 years, 8 months

hosts within recondite-computers.co.uk domain

by tonyblews＠gmail.com

Hi. I've got the much underused domain recondite-computers.co.uk, which I thought I might as well offer up to anyone who wants a host name listed under it. Currently only www.recondite-computers.co.uk and tardis.recondite-computers.co.uk are being used (the same virtual machine). All the mail for the domain currently bounces via @tardis.decnet.org (as i never could get SMTP working on tardis), but i can add MX records if required. As I can't think of anything to do with it (it was originally for a Star Cops wiki that never happened), I thought I'd offer it up to you lot. Tony.

11 years, 8 months

OpenVMS on VAXstation 4000/60

by mark＠wickensonline.co.uk

On 03/10/2013 03:01, Cory Smelosky wrote: On Thu, 3 Oct 2013, Dave McGuire wrote: Sweet! :-) I'm thinking I'll stick with VMS 6.2. With patches. I like trying appropriate vintage VMS for the machines. It's weird how the subtle differences creep in. It's obvious at 6.1 how much TCP/IP, for example, is a 'bolt on'. Not required for the OS. DECnet and underlying clustering protocols working just fine on their own. Happy days. It's also an excuse to break out the SPL and install some of the wonderful old tools and apps. Regards, Mark. -- http://www.wickensonline.co.uk http://hecnet.eu http://declegacy.org.uk http://retrochallenge.net https://twitter.com/#!/%40urbancamo

11 years, 8 months

VT-62?

by wilson＠dbit.com

From: "Jerome H. Fine" <jhfinedp3k at compsys.to> As for EDT, I have heard of it, but never found any details. Is there a LINK you can provide to a manual for EDT? Briefly, what additional features did EDT support over KED? If there were so many extra features, please pick just 3 or even 2 from EDT that you especially found to be so much of an improvement over KED? I only ever learned to use about 1% of EDT and it was already way more than KED. I think the turning point for EDT was V2.0 (which I think was where it started to smell more like KED). The craziest thing is that it's four editors (that I know of) in one: (a) "change" mode with keypad enabled -- the KED-like mode that most people actually use. (b) "change" mode with NOKEYPAD -- which is not modeless, so it's about as annoying as "vi" on Unix (e.g. "itext$" to insert text, instead of just typing text), but naturally not compatible with it or anything else. (c) "change" mode on a hardcopy terminal -- kinky!!! maybe a little more TECO-like, minus the power (so I guess maybe it's more EDIT.SAV-like then?). (d) line mode -- which is like pretty much any other line editor. Besides that, EDT has a near-infinite number of features. Multiple buffers are certainly a huge one. And yet, no LOCAL -- KED's greatest single features! John Wilson D Bit

11 years, 8 months

EISNER::and HECnet

by sampsa＠mac.com

On 3 Oct 2013, at 07:02, Daniel Soderstrom <snaggs at mac.com> wrote: I like to keep HECnet somewhat low volume, on topic, technical, yadda yadda. I don't want it to be a general forum for people to vent their hot air. If the list grows larger, I will have to start policing more. I agree, the volume of emails is growing. Many of these discussions would be better housed on a news or Eisner feed. I second that - I think we should move general discussions to DECTEC as it's meant for exactly this. I personally enjoy the witty responses to technical questions one gets in this list, but I have also noticed that some threads seem to spiral out of control - not that I'm wholly innocent myself :)

11 years, 8 months

EISNER::and HECnet

by snaggs＠mac.com

I like to keep HECnet somewhat low volume, on topic, technical, yadda yadda. I don't want it to be a general forum for people to vent their hot air. If the list grows larger, I will have to start policing more. I agree, the volume of emails is growing. Many of these discussions would be better housed on a news or Eisner feed.

11 years, 8 months

VT-62?

by jhfinedp3k＠compsys.to

>Dave McGuire wrote: On 10/02/2013 09:36 AM, Jerome H. Fine wrote: Another MACRO project was to add additional variants to the nine KED variants that DEC supports for RT-11 and RSTS/E. DEC supports the VT100, the VT52 and the VT62. I added the VT420 which supports more than 24 lines as I mentioned in my last post. Having a "terminal" with 44 lines was a huge advantage when I started to enhance SDHX.SYS, as I find when I type this post under Netscape and have about 36 lines in additional to all the tool bars. What I'm curious about is why EDT never appeared under RT-11. (or did it?) KED is respectable, but EDT is pure heaven. While RT-11 distributions always included a file named "EDIT.SAV" (or at least the ones I checked starting at V1 of RT-11 and ending at V05.07 of RT-11), the last official release of TECO was in V04.00 of RT-11 (and the identical file was also included in the V05.00 and the V05.07 releases). The first release of KED that I can find was with V04.00 of RT-11 in 1980. Thereafter, Ked.SAV was always included in every release. As for EDT, I have heard of it, but never found any details. Is there a LINK you can provide to a manual for EDT? Briefly, what additional features did EDT support over KED? If there were so many extra features, please pick just 3 or even 2 from EDT that you especially found to be so much of an improvement over KED? I know that the standard DEC Ked.SAV release has a very small cut / paste buffer which I have extended to over 16 KB along with a working buffer of 22 KB. That can easily be changed back and forth as needed if a user requires one of the buffers to be much larger. At one point, although I knew how to define a MACRO (LEARN), it was not clear how easy it was to execute that MACRO as many times as I wanted to, so I no longer need to use TECO for even complicated repeat things. The HELP screens were not much help since they did not show the current status of variable things such as: (a) The names of OPEN files (b) The current search string (c) The current search settings Since I added support to Ked.SAV for the VT420 with more than 24 lines (the new variant name is K42.SAV), I find K42 to be much more useful. It can also handle up to 255 columns, although even under the Win32 variant of Ersatz-11, the maximum my video card and monitor will support is 69 lines by 199 columns. Since I almost always prefer to use the DOS variant of Ersatz-11, I normally use the largest screen sizes which my video card supports in FULL SCREEN: 50 lines by 80 columns 44 lines by 132 columns As for the size of a file, KED can handle an input file of up to 16 MB and an output file of up to 16 MB. And what is the single feature under EDT which you like the most which KED does not support? Jerome Fine

11 years, 8 months

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