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OpenVMS 6.1 Cluster - Alpha not booting to form cluster

by mark＠wickensonline.co.uk

On 08/10/2013 12:15, Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman- wrote: Mark Wickens writes: On 08/10/2013 11:33, Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman- wrote: Mark Wickens writes: Just wondered if anyone would know why my Alpha when booting hangs at the point where it attempting to determine whether to join or form a VMS cluster? It is clustered with a VAX - if I boot the VAX first the VAX creates a cluster which the Alpha will then happily join when turned on, but if I power the Alpha without the VAX it just hangs. Both are running an install straight from an original VMS 6.1 installation disk. Just 2 nodes? What's your quorum configuration? Post: $ MCR SYSGEN SHOW VOTES $ MCR SYSGEN SHOW EXPECTED_VOTES ..from each node. I think you, sir, may have found the issue: On RIPLEY (the Alpha): $ mcr sysgen show votes Parameter Name Current Default Min. Max. Unit Dynamic -------------- ------- ------- ------- ------- ---- ------- VOTES 1 1 0 127 Votes $ mcr sysgen show expected votes Parameter Name Current Default Min. Max. Unit Dynamic -------------- ------- ------- ------- ------- ---- ------- EXPECTED_VOTES 2 1 1 127 Votes On DALLAS (the VAX): $ mcr sysgen show votes Parameter Name Current Default Min. Max. Unit Dynamic -------------- ------- ------- ------- ------- ---- ------- VOTES 1 1 0 127 Votes $ mcr sysgen show expected votes Parameter Name Current Default Min. Max. Unit Dynamic -------------- ------- ------- ------- ------- ---- ------- EXPECTED_VOTES 1 1 1 127 Votes OK. First, 2 node clusters can be problematic due to not realy having the necessary number of node to properly form a cluster. The minimum is three nodes to form a cluster. However, let's look at what you said. You said that the VAX boots and forms a cluster. It has one vote and the expected votes is one. Therefore, when you boot it, it sees the necessary number of votes to continue booting and form a cluster. You also said that Alpha boots and hangs trying to form a cluster. It too has one vote but its expected votes is two. Therefore, until the VAX has booted, the number of votes is not present and the Alpha will hang. If you lower expected votes, the Alpha wil boot just like the VAX does. I would caution you read the VMS documentation regarding clusters and how to determine quorum. You risk, in the configuration of two nodes where each has one vote and expected votes of one, partitioning the cluster resulting in data corruption. Thanks for the reminder of these issues. To be honest my experience with clustering is limited and generally specific to satellite based configurations. In this case I may make the VAX a satellite of the Alpha with the local disk acting as page/swap. Am I right in thinking then that the relationship changes somewhat in that the Alpha will always need to be up but the VAX can come and go as it pleases (with the correct shutdown sequence)? Regards, Mark. -- http://www.wickensonline.co.uk http://hecnet.eu http://declegacy.org.uk http://retrochallenge.net https://twitter.com/#!/%40urbancamo

11 years, 11 months

EISNER:: ?

by jferraro＠gmail.com

Yeah, that's the way to go. I'm tempted to buy an ancient Nokia GSM phone, get a data number for it and a serial adapter, and plug it into my DS300..9600 bps dial up access, woo hoo! I kinda still enjoy dial up... are there any active modems on 'the net'? Sampsa, you and I tried this once, a long time back... not sure if we ever connected, but I didn't have POTS at the time...

11 years, 11 months

OpenVMS 6.1 Cluster - Alpha not booting to form cluster

by system＠TMESIS.COM

Mark Wickens writes: On 08/10/2013 11:33, Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman- wrote: Mark Wickens writes: Just wondered if anyone would know why my Alpha when booting hangs at the point where it attempting to determine whether to join or form a VMS cluster? It is clustered with a VAX - if I boot the VAX first the VAX creates a cluster which the Alpha will then happily join when turned on, but if I power the Alpha without the VAX it just hangs. Both are running an install straight from an original VMS 6.1 installation disk. Just 2 nodes? What's your quorum configuration? Post: $ MCR SYSGEN SHOW VOTES $ MCR SYSGEN SHOW EXPECTED_VOTES ..from each node. I think you, sir, may have found the issue: On RIPLEY (the Alpha): $ mcr sysgen show votes Parameter Name Current Default Min. Max. Unit Dynamic -------------- ------- ------- ------- ------- ---- ------- VOTES 1 1 0 127 Votes $ mcr sysgen show expected votes Parameter Name Current Default Min. Max. Unit Dynamic -------------- ------- ------- ------- ------- ---- ------- EXPECTED_VOTES 2 1 1 127 Votes On DALLAS (the VAX): $ mcr sysgen show votes Parameter Name Current Default Min. Max. Unit Dynamic -------------- ------- ------- ------- ------- ---- ------- VOTES 1 1 0 127 Votes $ mcr sysgen show expected votes Parameter Name Current Default Min. Max. Unit Dynamic -------------- ------- ------- ------- ------- ---- ------- EXPECTED_VOTES 1 1 1 127 Votes OK. First, 2 node clusters can be problematic due to not realy having the necessary number of node to properly form a cluster. The minimum is three nodes to form a cluster. However, let's look at what you said. You said that the VAX boots and forms a cluster. It has one vote and the expected votes is one. Therefore, when you boot it, it sees the necessary number of votes to continue booting and form a cluster. You also said that Alpha boots and hangs trying to form a cluster. It too has one vote but its expected votes is two. Therefore, until the VAX has booted, the number of votes is not present and the Alpha will hang. If you lower expected votes, the Alpha wil boot just like the VAX does. I would caution you read the VMS documentation regarding clusters and how to determine quorum. You risk, in the configuration of two nodes where each has one vote and expected votes of one, partitioning the cluster resulting in data corruption. -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG Well I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.

11 years, 11 months

EISNER:: ?

by mark＠wickensonline.co.uk

On 08/10/2013 06:24, Cory Smelosky wrote: On Tue, 8 Oct 2013, Daniel Soderstrom wrote: Oh.. I thought that somehow LAT was routable over DECnet. I thought I remember in the old days some remote sites just had a terminal server and a couple of terminals. Many beers ago. So, I could go from the DECserver to my local vax, and then bounce out? That's what I do. (Well, DECserver to a FreeBSD box, and then to the world if I want to send email...like this particular one was sent from a VT320 on a DECserver 200/MC) Last night I was basking in the glow of an orange VT320 as I used that and a DECserver to get around HECNET. AFAIR Johnny's bridge is capable of forwarding LAT so I can see a load of services on the DECSERVER if I type SHOW SERVICE. I also noticed that SET HOST LA75, which is meant to be a printer port on the DECSERVER in the basement gave me SYSTEM access to SLAVE. Woops, a little reconfiguration required there! Regards, Mark. Daniel. On 08/10/2013, at 10:27 AM, Tim Sneddon <tim at sneddon.id.au> wrote: On Tue, Oct 8, 2013 at 10:23 AM, Sampsa Laine <sampsa at mac.com> wrote: On 8 Oct 2013, at 04:19, Cory Smelosky <b4 at gewt.net> wrote: On Tue, 8 Oct 2013, Daniel Soderstrom wrote: SET HOST EISNER straight from a DECServer will be nice. A DECserver speaking DECnet? That'd be awesome to have. Mine (albeit awesome, and one of my favourite things) only speaks LAT. ;) My DS300 does inbound Telnet as well as inbound/outbound LAT and serial :) No DECNET as far as I know. I don't recall a DECserver that talks DECnet. It is the wrong protocol for that type of communication. DECservers originally only spoke LAT, which was developed specifically for local area communications (which it does very well). Regards, Tim. -- http://www.wickensonline.co.uk http://hecnet.eu http://declegacy.org.uk http://retrochallenge.net https://twitter.com/#!/%40urbancamo

11 years, 11 months

OpenVMS 6.1 Cluster - Alpha not booting to form cluster

by mark＠wickensonline.co.uk

On 08/10/2013 11:33, Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman- wrote: Mark Wickens writes: Just wondered if anyone would know why my Alpha when booting hangs at the point where it attempting to determine whether to join or form a VMS cluster? It is clustered with a VAX - if I boot the VAX first the VAX creates a cluster which the Alpha will then happily join when turned on, but if I power the Alpha without the VAX it just hangs. Both are running an install straight from an original VMS 6.1 installation disk. Just 2 nodes? What's your quorum configuration? Post: $ MCR SYSGEN SHOW VOTES $ MCR SYSGEN SHOW EXPECTED_VOTES ..from each node. I think you, sir, may have found the issue: On RIPLEY (the Alpha): $ mcr sysgen show votes Parameter Name Current Default Min. Max. Unit Dynamic -------------- ------- ------- ------- ------- ---- ------- VOTES 1 1 0 127 Votes $ mcr sysgen show expected votes Parameter Name Current Default Min. Max. Unit Dynamic -------------- ------- ------- ------- ------- ---- ------- EXPECTED_VOTES 2 1 1 127 Votes On DALLAS (the VAX): $ mcr sysgen show votes Parameter Name Current Default Min. Max. Unit Dynamic -------------- ------- ------- ------- ------- ---- ------- VOTES 1 1 0 127 Votes $ mcr sysgen show expected votes Parameter Name Current Default Min. Max. Unit Dynamic -------------- ------- ------- ------- ------- ---- ------- EXPECTED_VOTES 1 1 1 127 Votes -- http://www.wickensonline.co.uk http://hecnet.eu http://declegacy.org.uk http://retrochallenge.net https://twitter.com/#!/%40urbancamo

11 years, 11 months

OpenVMS 6.1 Cluster - Alpha not booting to form cluster

by system＠TMESIS.COM

Mark Wickens writes: Just wondered if anyone would know why my Alpha when booting hangs at the point where it attempting to determine whether to join or form a VMS cluster? It is clustered with a VAX - if I boot the VAX first the VAX creates a cluster which the Alpha will then happily join when turned on, but if I power the Alpha without the VAX it just hangs. Both are running an install straight from an original VMS 6.1 installation disk. Just 2 nodes? What's your quorum configuration? Post: $ MCR SYSGEN SHOW VOTES $ MCR SYSGEN SHOW EXPECTED_VOTES ..from each node. -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG Well I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.

11 years, 11 months

OpenVMS 6.1 Cluster - Alpha not booting to form cluster

by mark＠wickensonline.co.uk

Just wondered if anyone would know why my Alpha when booting hangs at the point where it attempting to determine whether to join or form a VMS cluster? It is clustered with a VAX - if I boot the VAX first the VAX creates a cluster which the Alpha will then happily join when turned on, but if I power the Alpha without the VAX it just hangs. Both are running an install straight from an original VMS 6.1 installation disk. Regards, Mark. -- http://www.wickensonline.co.uk http://hecnet.eu http://declegacy.org.uk http://retrochallenge.net https://twitter.com/#!/%40urbancamo

11 years, 11 months

DEC Salle 1987

by sampsa＠mac.com

$ CREATE/DIRECTORY DROPBOX:[DROPBOX] $ SET SECURITY DROPBOX:[000000]DROPBOX.DIR/OWNER=... - /PROTECTION=(S:WRE,O:WRE,G:WRE,W:WRE) - /ACL=(DEFAULT_PROTECTION,SYSTEM:WRED,OWNER:R,GROUP:R,WORLD:R) I've had a little play and it seems to work as expected. Well, as I expect it to. I'll try that once I've had some sleep, been up far too long again.. Sampsa

11 years, 11 months

DEC Salle 1987

by tim＠sneddon.id.au

On Tue, Oct 8, 2013 at 1:20 PM, Cory Smelosky <b4 at gewt.net> wrote: On Tue, 8 Oct 2013, Tim Sneddon wrote: On Tue, Oct 8, 2013 at 10:22 AM, Cory Smelosky <b4 at gewt.net> wrote: On Tue, 8 Oct 2013, Sampsa Laine wrote: On 8 Oct 2013, at 01:52, Sampsa Laine <sampsa at mac.com> wrote: Do we have an intranet site only accessible via DECnet? I dont put any (much) personal information on the net. Daniel. That's what I'm trying to do with the "Dropbox" on CHIMPY:: - anyone can add or view files, but not delete or edit them. Just not sure what the correct security setting for the directory should be... Is this type of security option on a dir possible? I can't figure out how to set it up, but somebody amongst you gurus must know :) You can set RWE for world set on the directory by default, but have a script periodically set all files to w:RE only. There's probably a better way to do it, though. That sounds pretty, well, yuck. I prefer the "outside the box" approach to solving problems. ;) Weird > elegant in my book usually. I can certainly appreciate your interest there. However, it just makes my skin crawl. If you do it right the first time... Not that I have given it much thought you would likely be able to achieve this sort of environment using ACLs. I recommend checking out the VMS security manual. Do ACLs like that carry over DECnet? I seem to recall Brian S. saying they don't. You are correct, sort of. However, you wouldn't apply the ACL to the file. Rather, specify a default protection ACL on the directory to contain the files. This would configure the security attributes of any file placed in it, which to my thinking should work. I use something similar so that when I copy stuff into my FTP directories they are immediately set up to be served via either HTTP for FTP. Here is an example of the way to set it up (assuming DROPBOX is CONCEALED logical): $ CREATE/DIRECTORY DROPBOX:[DROPBOX] $ SET SECURITY DROPBOX:[000000]DROPBOX.DIR/OWNER=... - /PROTECTION=(S:WRE,O:WRE,G:WRE,W:WRE) - /ACL=(DEFAULT_PROTECTION,SYSTEM:WRED,OWNER:R,GROUP:R,WORLD:R) I've had a little play and it seems to work as expected. Well, as I expect it to. Regards, Tim.

11 years, 11 months

FYI: UUHECNET gateway now officially open

by b4＠gewt.net

On Tue, 8 Oct 2013, Sampsa Laine wrote: Thanks to Cory's efforts and the advice of the community, we finally rigged up a VMS box to talk to UUHECNET directly. There's actual RS-232 involved, too. Along with a utility named "ser2net". The address format is: MOIRA::uucp%"host!host!etc!username" Most hosts are connected to b4gate, so a bangpath starting with b4gate will probably get your message delivered. I've tested this with originating a message from RSTS/E (9.7) and CHIMPY. Replies in all directions work. The UUHECnet relay will work properly for all once Johnny updates 9.1 to MOIRA, nukes the current MOIRA, and everyone pulls the current database. Replies from UUHECNET also work. Sampsa -- Cory Smelosky http://gewt.net Personal stuff http://gimme-sympathy.org Projects

11 years, 11 months

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