From: Johnny Billquist <bqt at softjar.se>
I am much more nervous about the (to my view) really crappy and scary
plugs you use in the US. They actually have a fair chance of actually
exposing me to contact...
I can't argue with that. They'd *never* be approved if they were invented
today, but we're used to being careful and people hate change.
I always figure the same thing about train crossings: no way that would
be legal if we weren't already used to it. It's going 60 MPH / 100 kph, has
no steering, just one headlight, the brakes take minutes to work, and the
engineer can't see cross-traffic until he's right on top of it, but don't
worry; there's a flashing red light. And maybe a bell. And if you're
in town, a flimsy wooden slat. Safe!
I had a nutty uncle in the UK who wired his house for 24 VDC (and mounted
truck taillight bulbs in all the lamps), and used US-style plugs for that.
*That's* safe enough.
John Wilson
D Bit
On 2015-01-26 17:40, John Wilson wrote:
From: Johnny Billquist <bqt at softjar.se>
This is Europe, remember...
Normal mains are 230V, and 3-phase are 410V phase to phase. All the DEC
equipment around here are designed to run on that stuff.
Sure ... I remember reading the back plate on a dryer at a laundromat once
(in I forget which country) and suddenly not wanting to touch it any more.
I just have trouble getting used to the fact that although you *already*
run most things at what Americans would consider double voltage, you *still*
double the voltage for the big toys (things which we grudgingly whip out
the 230 VAC for). But then again, once it's lethal, I suppose it doesn't
matter how lethal. And copper costs more than insulation so being able
to use wimpier wire for the same wattage is good design. Less loss too.
Plus, this is stuff you pretty much never unplug/replug, so your fingers
are almost never near the live prongs. Still ... around here, it's hard
to find wire that's insulated for more than 300V.
Yeah... That "lethal" aspect have never been my issue. 110V or 230V. Who cares? If it comes to the wrong place, either will kill me.
And just through two fingers on the same hand, they both just annoy the hell out of me, and I swear loudly for a few minutes...
I am much more nervous about the (to my view) really crappy and scary plugs you use in the US. They actually have a fair chance of actually exposing me to contact...
You really cannot touch the prongs when they have power on plugs around here...
Johnny
On 2015-01-26 16:47, G. wrote:
On Mon, 26 Jan 2015 14:49:43 +0100, Johnny Billquist wrote:
This is Europe, remember...
Normal mains are 230V, and 3-phase are 410V phase to phase. All the DEC
equipment around here are designed to run on that stuff.
Aehm, shouldn't it be 230 * SQRT(3) = 398 (rounded up to 400) or the other way
400 / SQRT(3) = 230 (slighty rounded down)? :)
You are probably right. I was trying to remember if it was 400 or 410, but for some reason my brain decided that it was 410.
Actually, if I'm not wrong, 400 volts should be just a nominal standard voltage,
and some European countries have different real voltages, but they would be
still in range because of the allowed drift (something around plus/minus 6-10%).
I think there is something about that in Wikipedia. Again: if I'm not wrong. :)
No, that sounds right.
Indeed here in Italy nominal household voltage was 220 volts up until few years
ago, and it still is: just now I have a 219 volts reading at the outlet, and I
live downtown in a quite big northern city (i.e. not countryside).
Sweden moved "officially" from 220V to 230V many years ago. Probably more than 20 years or so.
In everyday speaking even electricians still refer to 3-phase 400 volt power as
"three eighty" (lit. tre ottanta) i.e. the old 380 volt nominal voltage. :)
I sortof remember that too... :-)
(Well, the Swedish variant thereof...)
P.S. I think that the UK may still be on 240/415 actual voltage even if they
adhere to the European standards about the unified 230/400 delivery.
Yeah. As far as I can remember, they are officially with the 230V crowd, but the actual power at the outlet can vary. :-)
Johnny
5.2.x.x - - [26/Jan/2015:08:16:43 -0800] "GET /cd-image/AG-PJ4YV-XE.iso.zip HTTP/1.0" 200 175730136 "-" "Wget/1.10.2c (VMS Alpha V8.3)"
Now that s a user agent I don t see every day :)
Ian
On Jan 26, 2015, at 7:51 AM, Sampsa Laine <sampsa at mac.com> wrote:
OK, grabbing those now.
On 26 Jan 2015, at 17:35, Ian McLaughlin <ian at platinum.net> wrote:
Here s my collection:
http://www.vaxhaven.com/CD_Image_Archive
Ian
On Jan 26, 2015, at 7:33 AM, Sampsa Laine <sampsa at mac.com> wrote:
Someone mentioned a site where I could download layered product / SDL CDs?
I've just set up a new node with pretty much limitless (well up to 2-3 TB) of room on a fast link, I figured I could mirror the contents of these for other HECnet users' convenience, sort of like I did with RHESUS.
I'm also happy to mirror pretty much anything else DEC related, accessible both via HTTP and HECnet.
Sampsa
From: Johnny Billquist <bqt at softjar.se>
This is Europe, remember...
Normal mains are 230V, and 3-phase are 410V phase to phase. All the DEC
equipment around here are designed to run on that stuff.
Sure ... I remember reading the back plate on a dryer at a laundromat once
(in I forget which country) and suddenly not wanting to touch it any more.
I just have trouble getting used to the fact that although you *already*
run most things at what Americans would consider double voltage, you *still*
double the voltage for the big toys (things which we grudgingly whip out
the 230 VAC for). But then again, once it's lethal, I suppose it doesn't
matter how lethal. And copper costs more than insulation so being able
to use wimpier wire for the same wattage is good design. Less loss too.
Plus, this is stuff you pretty much never unplug/replug, so your fingers
are almost never near the live prongs. Still ... around here, it's hard
to find wire that's insulated for more than 300V.
John Wilson
D Bit
On Mon, 26 Jan 2015, G. wrote:
Indeed here in Italy nominal household voltage was 220 volts up until few years
ago, and it still is: just now I have a 219 volts reading at the outlet, and I
live downtown in a quite big northern city (i.e. not countryside).
In everyday speaking even electricians still refer to 3-phase 400 volt power as
"three eighty" (lit. tre ottanta) i.e. the old 380 volt nominal voltage. :)
I still see US technical documentation refer to mains as 110VAC...despite the fact it's been at least 115-117 for ... > 50 years. ;)
Nominally, it's still generally around 110 to 125.
Distribution in the US is a mix of many things, residential is normally standard though at least. ;)
Now...the code and breaker panels and outlets however...
HTH,
G.
P.S. I think that the UK may still be on 240/415 actual voltage even if they
adhere to the European standards about the unified 230/400 delivery.
--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Projects
I've had to send via Mutt. At the moment when I try and send using chrome and gmail, chrome crashes when I attempt to pick a file in the file dialog.
Rubbish. Back to the command line...
Mark.
On 26 January 2015 at 15:36, Sampsa Laine <sampsa at mac.com> wrote:
Send me your SSH key to sampsa at mac.com, I'll create an upload account for you.
sampsa
On 26 Jan 2015, at 17:34, Mark Wickens <mark at wickensonline.co.uk> wrote:
I can get all my stuff over to you now that I have a decent uplink speed.
On 26 January 2015 at 15:33, Sampsa Laine <sampsa at mac.com> wrote:
Someone mentioned a site where I could download layered product / SDL CDs?
I've just set up a new node with pretty much limitless (well up to 2-3 TB) of room on a fast link, I figured I could mirror the contents of these for other HECnet users' convenience, sort of like I did with RHESUS.
I'm also happy to mirror pretty much anything else DEC related, accessible both via HTTP and HECnet.
Sampsa
OK, grabbing those now.
On 26 Jan 2015, at 17:35, Ian McLaughlin <ian at platinum.net> wrote:
Here s my collection:
http://www.vaxhaven.com/CD_Image_Archive
Ian
On Jan 26, 2015, at 7:33 AM, Sampsa Laine <sampsa at mac.com> wrote:
Someone mentioned a site where I could download layered product / SDL CDs?
I've just set up a new node with pretty much limitless (well up to 2-3 TB) of room on a fast link, I figured I could mirror the contents of these for other HECnet users' convenience, sort of like I did with RHESUS.
I'm also happy to mirror pretty much anything else DEC related, accessible both via HTTP and HECnet.
Sampsa
On Mon, 26 Jan 2015 14:49:43 +0100, Johnny Billquist wrote:
This is Europe, remember...
Normal mains are 230V, and 3-phase are 410V phase to phase. All the DEC
equipment around here are designed to run on that stuff.
Aehm, shouldn't it be 230 * SQRT(3) = 398 (rounded up to 400) or the other way
400 / SQRT(3) = 230 (slighty rounded down)? :)
Actually, if I'm not wrong, 400 volts should be just a nominal standard voltage,
and some European countries have different real voltages, but they would be
still in range because of the allowed drift (something around plus/minus 6-10%).
I think there is something about that in Wikipedia. Again: if I'm not wrong. :)
Indeed here in Italy nominal household voltage was 220 volts up until few years
ago, and it still is: just now I have a 219 volts reading at the outlet, and I
live downtown in a quite big northern city (i.e. not countryside).
In everyday speaking even electricians still refer to 3-phase 400 volt power as
"three eighty" (lit. tre ottanta) i.e. the old 380 volt nominal voltage. :)
HTH,
G.
P.S. I think that the UK may still be on 240/415 actual voltage even if they
adhere to the European standards about the unified 230/400 delivery.
Send me your SSH key to sampsa at mac.com, I'll create an upload account for you.
sampsa
On 26 Jan 2015, at 17:34, Mark Wickens <mark at wickensonline.co.uk> wrote:
I can get all my stuff over to you now that I have a decent uplink speed.
On 26 January 2015 at 15:33, Sampsa Laine <sampsa at mac.com> wrote:
Someone mentioned a site where I could download layered product / SDL CDs?
I've just set up a new node with pretty much limitless (well up to 2-3 TB) of room on a fast link, I figured I could mirror the contents of these for other HECnet users' convenience, sort of like I did with RHESUS.
I'm also happy to mirror pretty much anything else DEC related, accessible both via HTTP and HECnet.
Sampsa
