That said, anyone running v8 or higher? I'm running v8.0-6.
On Fri, Jan 6, 2012 at 4:33 PM, <Paul_Koning at dell.com> wrote:
Nope. DECnet/E V2.0 goes with RSTS/E V7.1 (or some later versions, I'm not sure when V2.1 kicked in). Note also that V2.0 is DECnet Phase III, which means you have to pay attention to the limitations that introduces when you tie it into a Phase IV network.
paul
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Mark Abene
Sent: Friday, January 06, 2012 4:21 PM
To: hecnet at update.uu.se
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
I don't recall offhand if the DECnet/E 2.0 tape image floating around is compatible with RSTS/E v7. Can anyone else comment?
On Thu, Jan 5, 2012 at 11:15 PM, Kevin Reynolds <tpresence at hotmail.com> wrote:
I have RSTS/E but its v7.
Kevin
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2012 22:29:01 -0500
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
From: phiber at phiber.com
To: hecnet at update.uu.se
Assuming Rob makes his patch to SIMH available, is there anyone on
HECnet willing to test peering with my RSTS/E setup?
On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 5:45 PM, Rob Jarratt
<robert.jarratt at ntlworld.com>
wrote:
Yes, you are right, I do add a 2-byte length to the start of each
buffer that I send so that the other end can reassemble the buffer.
Sorry, I did say this in an earlier draft of the email, but decided
to leave it out to emphasise the simplicity of the implementation.
Regards
Rob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
On Behalf Of Paul_Koning at Dell.com
Sent: 04 January 2012 22:15
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: RE: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
I assume there has to be a bit more to it, because DDCMP is a
packet based protocol (not a stream protocol as TCP is) and the
higher layers rely on
that.
So there presumably is some form of framing in the emulated data
stream to indicate where the packet boundaries are.
paul
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
On Behalf Of Rob Jarratt
Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 5:11 PM
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: RE: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
All I do in SIMH is to take the data bytes each end wants to send
to the
other
end and send them over a socket, so I don't get involved with
DDCMP
itself.
Both ends have to be SIMH for this to work. I don't do anything at
the
actual
hardware level, although that would be nice. I think you can get
synchronous
serial cards for the PC but they are quite expensive.
Regards
Rob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
[mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
On Behalf Of Paul_Koning at Dell.com
Sent: 03 January 2012 21:18
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: RE: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
DMC-11 speaks DDCMP V3.1 (give or take some bugs in the "high speed"
version). But that's sync only. Depending on what you want to
talk to, a
DMC
(or its relatives DMR-11, DMP-11, or DMV-11) may not help; if
the other
end
speaks DDCMP over an async link (UART) then it won't work
because the character framing doesn't match.
That said, I wonder what it means to emulate a DMC-11. You
could have it speak DDCMP over a UART, or something else
entirely. If the former it
would
talk to another DDCMP node; if the latter it would not but it
would still
work
for tying one emulated DMC-11 to another.
If you want DDCMP, one approach is to get a copy of the spec,
and
implement
what it says. That works; it is how I implemented DDCMP support
for RSTS
V10
(based on an earlier version based on V9.6). The protocol is
quite simple
and
the spec is well enough written that, if you do what it says,
the result
WILL
interoperate with hardware such as the DMR-11. The only tricky
one is the
DMC-11 because it has some undocumented bugs; the main one I
remember
is that the high speed version can't handle back to back
packets. I wish
I could
contribute the code I wrote but I can't, for various reasons
one of them
is that
it's a RSTS device driver and written in 100% assembly language.
It would not be hard to do a version for other platforms; I once
looked at
a
Linux terminal protocol handler (forgot what that is called)
that could
hook
into DECnet/Linux. Didn't get far enough on that, though.
paul
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
[mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
On Behalf Of Mark Abene
Sent: Sunday, January 01, 2012 6:06 PM
To: hecnet at update.uu.se
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
Jarratt, did you make this publicly available on the SIMH list?
It would
be great
to have a DMC11 device emulated, since I insist on running
RSTS/E v8 (for historical reasons... it was the last real RSTS
before "the
pollution").
RSTS/E v8
doesn't have ethernet support, so the only way I could have
DECnet is via
a
(previously unemulated)
DMC11 interface. Does yours work well?
-Mark
On Sun, Jan 1, 2012 at 3:23 AM, Jarratt RMA
<robert.jarratt at ntlworld.com>
wrote:
Working with a friend, I have written a SIMH emulation of the
DMC11 device, so you can do this with SIMH. It tunnels the
bytes sent to/from the device over a socket. We have used the
SIMH emulation to connect my friend to HECnet over a
(simulated) DMC11.
The bit I am not entirely sure about is to what extent this is
using DDCMP as I don't have a full understanding of DDCMP.
Regards
Rob
On 31 December 2011 18:46, The Presence
<tpresence at hotmail.com>
wrote:
Hey guys,
Has anyone worked out a mechanism to connect a node to hecnet
using
DDCMP?
Perhaps some tunneling technology over IP, or virtualized serial?
Kevin
On 6 Jan 2012, at 00:16, Johnny Billquist wrote:
STAR69 is in serious yo-yo mode as seen from MIM right now. Anyone know why?
For some reason my router had become un-configured and wasn't opening port
4711 for the bridge. It might have been causing traffic problems and time-outs.
Also it may explain the lack of connectivity from other nodes, but I'm going
to look over it with Steve D anyway to see what's awry if anything.
--
Mark Benson
http://DECtec.info
Twitter: @DECtecInfo
HECnet: STAR69::MARK
Online Resource & Mailing List for DEC Enthusiasts.
Nope. DECnet/E V2.0 goes with RSTS/E V7.1 (or some later versions, I'm not sure when V2.1 kicked in). Note also that V2.0 is DECnet Phase III, which means you have to pay attention to the limitations that introduces when you tie it into a Phase IV network.
paul
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Mark Abene
Sent: Friday, January 06, 2012 4:21 PM
To: hecnet at update.uu.se
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
I don't recall offhand if the DECnet/E 2.0 tape image floating around is compatible with RSTS/E v7. Can anyone else comment?
On Thu, Jan 5, 2012 at 11:15 PM, Kevin Reynolds <tpresence at hotmail.com> wrote:
I have RSTS/E but its v7.
Kevin
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2012 22:29:01 -0500
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
From: phiber at phiber.com
To: hecnet at update.uu.se
Assuming Rob makes his patch to SIMH available, is there anyone on
HECnet willing to test peering with my RSTS/E setup?
On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 5:45 PM, Rob Jarratt
<robert.jarratt at ntlworld.com>
wrote:
Yes, you are right, I do add a 2-byte length to the start of each
buffer that I send so that the other end can reassemble the buffer.
Sorry, I did say this in an earlier draft of the email, but decided
to leave it out to emphasise the simplicity of the implementation.
Regards
Rob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
On Behalf Of Paul_Koning at Dell.com
Sent: 04 January 2012 22:15
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: RE: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
I assume there has to be a bit more to it, because DDCMP is a
packet based protocol (not a stream protocol as TCP is) and the
higher layers rely on
that.
So there presumably is some form of framing in the emulated data
stream to indicate where the packet boundaries are.
paul
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
On Behalf Of Rob Jarratt
Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 5:11 PM
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: RE: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
All I do in SIMH is to take the data bytes each end wants to send
to the
other
end and send them over a socket, so I don't get involved with
DDCMP
itself.
Both ends have to be SIMH for this to work. I don't do anything at
the
actual
hardware level, although that would be nice. I think you can get
synchronous
serial cards for the PC but they are quite expensive.
Regards
Rob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
[mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
On Behalf Of Paul_Koning at Dell.com
Sent: 03 January 2012 21:18
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: RE: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
DMC-11 speaks DDCMP V3.1 (give or take some bugs in the "high speed"
version). But that's sync only. Depending on what you want to
talk to, a
DMC
(or its relatives DMR-11, DMP-11, or DMV-11) may not help; if
the other
end
speaks DDCMP over an async link (UART) then it won't work
because the character framing doesn't match.
That said, I wonder what it means to emulate a DMC-11. You
could have it speak DDCMP over a UART, or something else
entirely. If the former it
would
talk to another DDCMP node; if the latter it would not but it
would still
work
for tying one emulated DMC-11 to another.
If you want DDCMP, one approach is to get a copy of the spec,
and
implement
what it says. That works; it is how I implemented DDCMP support
for RSTS
V10
(based on an earlier version based on V9.6). The protocol is
quite simple
and
the spec is well enough written that, if you do what it says,
the result
WILL
interoperate with hardware such as the DMR-11. The only tricky
one is the
DMC-11 because it has some undocumented bugs; the main one I
remember
is that the high speed version can't handle back to back
packets. I wish
I could
contribute the code I wrote but I can't, for various reasons
one of them
is that
it's a RSTS device driver and written in 100% assembly language.
It would not be hard to do a version for other platforms; I once
looked at
a
Linux terminal protocol handler (forgot what that is called)
that could
hook
into DECnet/Linux. Didn't get far enough on that, though.
paul
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
[mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
On Behalf Of Mark Abene
Sent: Sunday, January 01, 2012 6:06 PM
To: hecnet at update.uu.se
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
Jarratt, did you make this publicly available on the SIMH list?
It would
be great
to have a DMC11 device emulated, since I insist on running
RSTS/E v8 (for historical reasons... it was the last real RSTS
before "the
pollution").
RSTS/E v8
doesn't have ethernet support, so the only way I could have
DECnet is via
a
(previously unemulated)
DMC11 interface. Does yours work well?
-Mark
On Sun, Jan 1, 2012 at 3:23 AM, Jarratt RMA
<robert.jarratt at ntlworld.com>
wrote:
Working with a friend, I have written a SIMH emulation of the
DMC11 device, so you can do this with SIMH. It tunnels the
bytes sent to/from the device over a socket. We have used the
SIMH emulation to connect my friend to HECnet over a
(simulated) DMC11.
The bit I am not entirely sure about is to what extent this is
using DDCMP as I don't have a full understanding of DDCMP.
Regards
Rob
On 31 December 2011 18:46, The Presence
<tpresence at hotmail.com>
wrote:
Hey guys,
Has anyone worked out a mechanism to connect a node to hecnet
using
DDCMP?
Perhaps some tunneling technology over IP, or virtualized serial?
Kevin
I don't recall offhand if the DECnet/E 2.0 tape image floating around
is compatible with RSTS/E v7. Can anyone else comment?
On Thu, Jan 5, 2012 at 11:15 PM, Kevin Reynolds <tpresence at hotmail.com> wrote:
I have RSTS/E but its v7.
Kevin
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2012 22:29:01 -0500
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
From: phiber at phiber.com
To: hecnet at update.uu.se
Assuming Rob makes his patch to SIMH available, is there anyone on
HECnet willing to test peering with my RSTS/E setup?
On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 5:45 PM, Rob Jarratt <robert.jarratt at ntlworld.com>
wrote:
Yes, you are right, I do add a 2-byte length to the start of each buffer
that I send so that the other end can reassemble the buffer. Sorry, I
did
say this in an earlier draft of the email, but decided to leave it out
to
emphasise the simplicity of the implementation.
Regards
Rob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
On Behalf Of Paul_Koning at Dell.com
Sent: 04 January 2012 22:15
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: RE: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
I assume there has to be a bit more to it, because DDCMP is a packet
based
protocol (not a stream protocol as TCP is) and the higher layers rely
on
that.
So there presumably is some form of framing in the emulated data stream
to
indicate where the packet boundaries are.
paul
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
On Behalf Of Rob Jarratt
Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 5:11 PM
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: RE: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
All I do in SIMH is to take the data bytes each end wants to send to
the
other
end and send them over a socket, so I don't get involved with DDCMP
itself.
Both ends have to be SIMH for this to work. I don't do anything at the
actual
hardware level, although that would be nice. I think you can get
synchronous
serial cards for the PC but they are quite expensive.
Regards
Rob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
On Behalf Of Paul_Koning at Dell.com
Sent: 03 January 2012 21:18
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: RE: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
DMC-11 speaks DDCMP V3.1 (give or take some bugs in the "high speed"
version). But that's sync only. Depending on what you want to talk
to, a
DMC
(or its relatives DMR-11, DMP-11, or DMV-11) may not help; if the
other
end
speaks DDCMP over an async link (UART) then it won't work because the
character framing doesn't match.
That said, I wonder what it means to emulate a DMC-11. You could
have
it speak DDCMP over a UART, or something else entirely. If the
former
it
would
talk to another DDCMP node; if the latter it would not but it would
still
work
for tying one emulated DMC-11 to another.
If you want DDCMP, one approach is to get a copy of the spec, and
implement
what it says. That works; it is how I implemented DDCMP support for
RSTS
V10
(based on an earlier version based on V9.6). The protocol is quite
simple
and
the spec is well enough written that, if you do what it says, the
result
WILL
interoperate with hardware such as the DMR-11. The only tricky one
is
the
DMC-11 because it has some undocumented bugs; the main one I
remember
is that the high speed version can't handle back to back packets. I
wish
I could
contribute the code I wrote but I can't, for various reasons one of
them
is that
it's a RSTS device driver and written in 100% assembly language.
It would not be hard to do a version for other platforms; I once
looked at
a
Linux terminal protocol handler (forgot what that is called) that
could
hook
into DECnet/Linux. Didn't get far enough on that, though.
paul
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
On Behalf Of Mark Abene
Sent: Sunday, January 01, 2012 6:06 PM
To: hecnet at update.uu.se
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
Jarratt, did you make this publicly available on the SIMH list? It
would
be great
to have a DMC11 device emulated, since I insist on running RSTS/E v8
(for historical reasons... it was the last real RSTS before "the
pollution").
RSTS/E v8
doesn't have ethernet support, so the only way I could have DECnet is
via
a
(previously unemulated)
DMC11 interface. Does yours work well?
-Mark
On Sun, Jan 1, 2012 at 3:23 AM, Jarratt RMA
<robert.jarratt at ntlworld.com>
wrote:
Working with a friend, I have written a SIMH emulation of the DMC11
device, so you can do this with SIMH. It tunnels the bytes sent
to/from the device over a socket. We have used the SIMH emulation
to
connect my friend to HECnet over a (simulated) DMC11.
The bit I am not entirely sure about is to what extent this is
using
DDCMP as I don't have a full understanding of DDCMP.
Regards
Rob
On 31 December 2011 18:46, The Presence <tpresence at hotmail.com>
wrote:
Hey guys,
Has anyone worked out a mechanism to connect a node to hecnet
using
DDCMP?
Perhaps some tunneling technology over IP, or virtualized serial?
Kevin
I have RSTS/E but its v7.
Kevin
> Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2012 22:29:01 -0500
> Subject: Re: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
> From: phiber at phiber.com
> To: hecnet at update.uu.se
>
> Assuming Rob makes his patch to SIMH available, is there anyone on
> HECnet willing to test peering with my RSTS/E setup?
>
> On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 5:45 PM, Rob Jarratt <robert.jarratt at ntlworld.com> wrote:
> > Yes, you are right, I do add a 2-byte length to the start of each buffer
> > that I send so that the other end can reassemble the buffer. Sorry, I did
> > say this in an earlier draft of the email, but decided to leave it out to
> > emphasise the simplicity of the implementation.
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Rob
> >
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
> >> On Behalf Of Paul_Koning at Dell.com
> >> Sent: 04 January 2012 22:15
> >> To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
> >> Subject: RE: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
> >>
> >> I assume there has to be a bit more to it, because DDCMP is a packet based
> >> protocol (not a stream protocol as TCP is) and the higher layers rely on
> > that.
> >> So there presumably is some form of framing in the emulated data stream to
> >> indicate where the packet boundaries are.
> >>
> >> paul
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
> >> On Behalf Of Rob Jarratt
> >> Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 5:11 PM
> >> To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
> >> Subject: RE: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
> >>
> >> All I do in SIMH is to take the data bytes each end wants to send to the
> > other
> >> end and send them over a socket, so I don't get involved with DDCMP
> > itself.
> >> Both ends have to be SIMH for this to work. I don't do anything at the
> > actual
> >> hardware level, although that would be nice. I think you can get
> > synchronous
> >> serial cards for the PC but they are quite expensive.
> >>
> >> Regards
> >>
> >> Rob
> >>
> >> > -----Original Message-----
> >> > From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
> >> > On Behalf Of Paul_Koning at Dell.com
> >> > Sent: 03 January 2012 21:18
> >> > To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
> >> > Subject: RE: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
> >> >
> >> > DMC-11 speaks DDCMP V3.1 (give or take some bugs in the "high speed"
> >> > version). But that's sync only. Depending on what you want to talk
> >> > to, a
> >> DMC
> >> > (or its relatives DMR-11, DMP-11, or DMV-11) may not help; if the
> >> > other
> >> end
> >> > speaks DDCMP over an async link (UART) then it won't work because the
> >> > character framing doesn't match.
> >> >
> >> > That said, I wonder what it means to emulate a DMC-11. You could have
> >> > it speak DDCMP over a UART, or something else entirely. If the former
> >> > it
> >> would
> >> > talk to another DDCMP node; if the latter it would not but it would
> >> > still
> >> work
> >> > for tying one emulated DMC-11 to another.
> >> >
> >> > If you want DDCMP, one approach is to get a copy of the spec, and
> >> implement
> >> > what it says. That works; it is how I implemented DDCMP support for
> >> > RSTS
> >> V10
> >> > (based on an earlier version based on V9.6). The protocol is quite
> >> > simple
> >> and
> >> > the spec is well enough written that, if you do what it says, the
> >> > result
> >> WILL
> >> > interoperate with hardware such as the DMR-11. The only tricky one is
> >> > the
> >> > DMC-11 because it has some undocumented bugs; the main one I
> >> remember
> >> > is that the high speed version can't handle back to back packets. I
> >> > wish
> >> I could
> >> > contribute the code I wrote but I can't, for various reasons one of
> >> > them
> >> is that
> >> > it's a RSTS device driver and written in 100% assembly language.
> >> >
> >> > It would not be hard to do a version for other platforms; I once
> >> > looked at
> >> a
> >> > Linux terminal protocol handler (forgot what that is called) that
> >> > could
> >> hook
> >> > into DECnet/Linux. Didn't get far enough on that, though.
> >> >
> >> > paul
> >> >
> >> > -----Original Message-----
> >> > From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
> >> > On Behalf Of Mark Abene
> >> > Sent: Sunday, January 01, 2012 6:06 PM
> >> > To: hecnet at update.uu.se
> >> > Subject: Re: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
> >> >
> >> > Jarratt, did you make this publicly available on the SIMH list? It
> >> > would
> >> be great
> >> > to have a DMC11 device emulated, since I insist on running RSTS/E v8
> >> > (for historical reasons... it was the last real RSTS before "the
> > pollution").
> >> RSTS/E v8
> >> > doesn't have ethernet support, so the only way I could have DECnet is
> >> > via
> >> a
> >> > (previously unemulated)
> >> > DMC11 interface. Does yours work well?
> >> >
> >> > -Mark
> >> >
> >> > On Sun, Jan 1, 2012 at 3:23 AM, Jarratt RMA
> >> > <robert.jarratt at ntlworld.com>
> >> > wrote:
> >> > > Working with a friend, I have written a SIMH emulation of the DMC11
> >> > > device, so you can do this with SIMH. It tunnels the bytes sent
> >> > > to/from the device over a socket. We have used the SIMH emulation to
> >> > > connect my friend to HECnet over a (simulated) DMC11.
> >> > >
> >> > > The bit I am not entirely sure about is to what extent this is using
> >> > > DDCMP as I don't have a full understanding of DDCMP.
> >> > >
> >> > > Regards
> >> > >
> >> > > Rob
> >> > > On 31 December 2011 18:46, The Presence <tpresence at hotmail.com>
> >> > wrote:
> >> > >>
> >> > >> Hey guys,
> >> > >>
> >> > >> Has anyone worked out a mechanism to connect a node to hecnet using
> >> > DDCMP?
> >> > >> Perhaps some tunneling technology over IP, or virtualized serial?
> >> > >>
> >> > >> Kevin
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >
Assuming Rob makes his patch to SIMH available, is there anyone on
HECnet willing to test peering with my RSTS/E setup?
On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 5:45 PM, Rob Jarratt <robert.jarratt at ntlworld.com> wrote:
Yes, you are right, I do add a 2-byte length to the start of each buffer
that I send so that the other end can reassemble the buffer. Sorry, I did
say this in an earlier draft of the email, but decided to leave it out to
emphasise the simplicity of the implementation.
Regards
Rob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
On Behalf Of Paul_Koning at Dell.com
Sent: 04 January 2012 22:15
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: RE: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
I assume there has to be a bit more to it, because DDCMP is a packet based
protocol (not a stream protocol as TCP is) and the higher layers rely on
that.
So there presumably is some form of framing in the emulated data stream to
indicate where the packet boundaries are.
paul
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
On Behalf Of Rob Jarratt
Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 5:11 PM
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: RE: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
All I do in SIMH is to take the data bytes each end wants to send to the
other
end and send them over a socket, so I don't get involved with DDCMP
itself.
Both ends have to be SIMH for this to work. I don't do anything at the
actual
hardware level, although that would be nice. I think you can get
synchronous
serial cards for the PC but they are quite expensive.
Regards
Rob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
On Behalf Of Paul_Koning at Dell.com
Sent: 03 January 2012 21:18
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: RE: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
DMC-11 speaks DDCMP V3.1 (give or take some bugs in the "high speed"
version). But that's sync only. Depending on what you want to talk
to, a
DMC
(or its relatives DMR-11, DMP-11, or DMV-11) may not help; if the
other
end
speaks DDCMP over an async link (UART) then it won't work because the
character framing doesn't match.
That said, I wonder what it means to emulate a DMC-11. You could have
it speak DDCMP over a UART, or something else entirely. If the former
it
would
talk to another DDCMP node; if the latter it would not but it would
still
work
for tying one emulated DMC-11 to another.
If you want DDCMP, one approach is to get a copy of the spec, and
implement
what it says. That works; it is how I implemented DDCMP support for
RSTS
V10
(based on an earlier version based on V9.6). The protocol is quite
simple
and
the spec is well enough written that, if you do what it says, the
result
WILL
interoperate with hardware such as the DMR-11. The only tricky one is
the
DMC-11 because it has some undocumented bugs; the main one I
remember
is that the high speed version can't handle back to back packets. I
wish
I could
contribute the code I wrote but I can't, for various reasons one of
them
is that
it's a RSTS device driver and written in 100% assembly language.
It would not be hard to do a version for other platforms; I once
looked at
a
Linux terminal protocol handler (forgot what that is called) that
could
hook
into DECnet/Linux. Didn't get far enough on that, though.
paul
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE]
On Behalf Of Mark Abene
Sent: Sunday, January 01, 2012 6:06 PM
To: hecnet at update.uu.se
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Hecnet and DDCMP
Jarratt, did you make this publicly available on the SIMH list? It
would
be great
to have a DMC11 device emulated, since I insist on running RSTS/E v8
(for historical reasons... it was the last real RSTS before "the
pollution").
RSTS/E v8
doesn't have ethernet support, so the only way I could have DECnet is
via
a
(previously unemulated)
DMC11 interface. Does yours work well?
-Mark
On Sun, Jan 1, 2012 at 3:23 AM, Jarratt RMA
<robert.jarratt at ntlworld.com>
wrote:
Working with a friend, I have written a SIMH emulation of the DMC11
device, so you can do this with SIMH. It tunnels the bytes sent
to/from the device over a socket. We have used the SIMH emulation to
connect my friend to HECnet over a (simulated) DMC11.
The bit I am not entirely sure about is to what extent this is using
DDCMP as I don't have a full understanding of DDCMP.
Regards
Rob
On 31 December 2011 18:46, The Presence <tpresence at hotmail.com>
wrote:
Hey guys,
Has anyone worked out a mechanism to connect a node to hecnet using
DDCMP?
Perhaps some tunneling technology over IP, or virtualized serial?
Kevin
Mark,
Contact me offline. Maybe with a little bit of effort we can sort this out. I will be available early tomorrow or later in the afternoon. I am in the Eastern US (EST5EDT). If you have a skype account we can use that to sort through this.
-Steve
________________________________
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE on behalf of Mark Benson
Sent: Thu 1/5/2012 18:50
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Multinet circuit costs
On 5 Jan 2012, at 23:27, hvlems at zonnet.nl wrote:
More than one area router in a given area is never a problem because there is a mechanism that selects the active area router.
The copy problems are observed with Legato and Star69 (from memory).
There's a high likely hood something is misconfigured on STAR69 - I wouldn't honestly know if it was either unless someone pointed it out.
--
Mark Benson
http://DECtec.info <http://dectec.info/>
Twitter: @DECtecInfo
HECnet: STAR69::MARK
Online Resource & Mailing List for DEC Enthusiasts.
I noticed that as well...
-Steve
________________________________
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE on behalf of Johnny Billquist
Sent: Thu 1/5/2012 19:16
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: [HECnet] STAR69
STAR69 is in serious yo-yo mode as seen from MIM right now. Anyone know why?
Johnny
The HECNET INFO.TXT files is located in the default directory for the
FAL$SERVER account, which is referenced from other nodes using
<NODENAME>::INFO.TXT - for example SLAVE::INFO.TXT
[MSW]SLAVE$ type slave::info.txt
FWIW, this is not absolutely true if the nodes have proxy logins set up.
NODE:: actually means to use the proxy account; to force the default DECnet
account to be used, it's NODE""::
If you don't have proxy access set up, then the two do the same thing.
Bob
On 2012-01-06 00.27, hvlems at zonnet.nl wrote:
More than one area router in a given area is never a problem because there is a mechanism that selects the active area router.
No. There is not just one "active" area router. But if that was the case, then it could doubly become a problem. Assume the two area routers in an area do not have direct contact with each other. How would they decide which one was active?
But correct, having multiple area routers in an area is not a problem. Level 1 routers figure out which area router is the closest, and route all out-of-area traffic to the closest area router. However, if you have two area routers, but they do not have a direct contact with each other, things can become funny.
The copy problems are observed with Legato and Star69 (from memory).
Thanks. I'll try to look at it this weekend, if it hasn't been solved before then.
By the way, does any kind of traffic work, and only file copying is an issue, or what exactly have you observed?
Johnny
-----Original Message-----
From: Johnny Billquist<bqt at softjar.se>
Sender: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Date: Fri, 06 Jan 2012 00:21:17
To:<hecnet at Update.UU.SE>
Reply-To: hecnet at Update.UU.SESubject: Re: [HECnet] Multinet circuit costs
I would expect that your area should not ever be a problem. But if you
have two area routers for your area, you can potentially mess things up
for traffic going out of your area, or in to.
Well, there are other potential messups one can do as well. But could
you start by telling me between which machines you can observe the problem?
Johnny
On 2012-01-06 00.15, hvlems at zonnet.nl wrote:
Yes I agree that we have a problem. I cannot create the problem between any combination of nodes within my area. The only common factor is that both nodes I cannnot copy from all have a bridge and a tcp tunnel.
I haven't tried Ctakan yet. It's too late now.
Hans
-----Original Message-----
From: Johnny Billquist<bqt at softjar.se>
Sender: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Date: Fri, 06 Jan 2012 00:04:01
To:<hecnet at Update.UU.SE>
Reply-To: hecnet at Update.UU.SESubject: Re: [HECnet] Multinet circuit costs
Ok. So we do have a problem. Time to figure out what it is, then. I can
most definitely say that multiple paths is not the problem. However,
there could be some other problem with some machine/setup/paths/whatever
that is more local to you Hans.
If it works talking to MIM, and you have the bridge running, then it
becomes a question of which machines you have problems talking to, and
we can check at both ends what the next hop is and reason if that is
reasonable and correct.
Johnny
On 2012-01-05 16.40, hvlems at zonnet.nl wrote:
Again, apologies for topposting: my cellphone is somewhat rude...
PST is UTC-8 (unless Bob lives in the Philippines, then it's UTC+8 :).
Yes I have problems wihile copying files from Legato and Star69 to Ozon.
Ozon is the area router for area 44 and uses the bridge software.
I can't access the Hecnet map but Legato has multiple paths and IIRC so does Star.
Ozon has no problem copying files from MIM or MUSIPC and both are connected with single paths (IIRC again).
Reading Bob's analysis I still think that multiple paths may lead to errors. Granted that circuit cost may fix this but right now it is, for me at least, not clear.
The area information in the output of show network/old on Ozon shows all areas and about 40% is more than 1 hop away and seen as reachable thru Legato.
Hans
-----Original Message-----
From: "Bob Armstrong"<bob at jfcl.com>
Sender: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2012 07:14:50
To:<hecnet at Update.UU.SE>
Reply-To: hecnet at Update.UU.SESubject: RE: [HECnet] Multinet circuit costs
Why? What is the percieved problem?
I don't know about area 44, but I was talking to Hans on New Years Eve
about a problem where he could not copy files, while logged in to OZON, from
LEGATO (i.e. a "pull" transaction). According to Hans, it fails with "acp
file or directory lookup failed". If I did the same thing from my end (a
"push") it would start copying and actually create an empty file on OZON,
but then time out after a very long time with
-RMS-F-SYS, QIO system service request failed
-SYSTEM-F-LINKABORT, network partner aborted logical link
Last I heard Hans was going to check the NETSERVER/FAL logs on his side for
any error messages, but that was New Years Eve and he was otherwise occupied
:-)
I see this morning that Hans has actually created a file "TARGET.TXT" on
LEGATO (dated 6PM PST on 12/31 even - what time is that in the
Netherlands??) so maybe he's solved the problem. If he did he didn't tell
me what he did.
Hans also mentioned to me that he was having similar problems with the
node STAR69 and CANADA. I think all this came up when Hans was trying to
write his HECnet crawler script to gather INFO.TXT files...
I don't think this is related to the Multinet/Bridge configuration, but I
can't guarantee it. One hidden "gotcha" in DECnet is that the circuit costs
are determined locally, so the routings don't have to be symmetrical (i.e.
the route from A->B might not be the same as the route from B->A).
If somebody (Johnny??) wants to try to figure it out, be my guest -
GUEST/GUEST. I'm a little busy at the moment and don't really have time to
look at it.
Bob
