On 5 Apr 2012, at 11:47, John H. Reinhardt wrote:
Thanks. That's what I'd seen. The other probable show stopper for me is that it only runs under Windows. If I bought the emulator, then I'd have to also buy a Windows license to run it. :( But nobody seems to have a working Alpha emulator that runs under Linux. At least one without limitations that are annoying. The CHARON -AXP/ES40 for Linux NCE needs to be manually re-started every 30 days and it only allows 2 emulated scsi disks. I'm not even sure it's current. The documentation page says the binary expires on 12-31-2010 so apparently hasn't been updated in a while.
I'll still prob go for it - I've got a Win7 box doing nothing so I'll maybe move CHIMPY onto it..I think it might be as fast or even faster than the DS10, but we'll see. If not, I'll run it as an extra host, maybe cluster the two.
Whoa! new surprise. I logged into the Stromasys site to look at the downloads and the ES40 emulator has been retired! No longer available. You have your choice of a MicroVAX 3600/3900, DEC3000-400, AlphaServer 400 or AlphaServer DS10. The DS10 is Windows 64-bit XP/7 only. The DEC3000-400 is Windows 32-bit XP only. MicroVAX is Windows 32-bit, Linux 32-bit and ESXi (VMWare) and the AS400 is Windows 64-bit, Linux 64-bit and ESXi. What a motley assortment of supported hosts - none of which are what I'm looking for. :(
Yeah, that kinda sucks. I wrote them and asked about the ES40 NCE, let's see what they say.
Thanks. That's what I'd seen. The other probable show stopper for me is that it only runs under Windows. If I bought the emulator, then I'd have to also buy a Windows license to run it. :( But nobody seems to have a working Alpha emulator that runs under Linux. At least one without limitations that are annoying. The CHARON -AXP/ES40 for Linux NCE needs to be manually re-started every 30 days and it only allows 2 emulated scsi disks. I'm not even sure it's current. The documentation page says the binary expires on 12-31-2010 so apparently hasn't been updated in a while.
Whoa! new surprise. I logged into the Stromasys site to look at the downloads and the ES40 emulator has been retired! No longer available. You have your choice of a MicroVAX 3600/3900, DEC3000-400, AlphaServer 400 or AlphaServer DS10. The DS10 is Windows 64-bit XP/7 only. The DEC3000-400 is Windows 32-bit XP only. MicroVAX is Windows 32-bit, Linux 32-bit and ESXi (VMWare) and the AS400 is Windows 64-bit, Linux 64-bit and ESXi. What a motley assortment of supported hosts - none of which are what I'm looking for. :(
Here's the link although you'll probably have to create an account to see it. http://www.stromasys.ch/downloads/downloads-freeware/
John H. Reinhardt
On 4/5/12 4:13 AM, Sampsa Laine wrote:
Here's the SPD: http://www.migrationspecialties.com/pdf/Avanti_SPD.pdf
Sampsa
On 5 Apr 2012, at 11:07, John H. Reinhardt wrote:
I looked on the Migration Specialties web site and found FreeAXP and Avanti but no mention of a DS10 emulation. Can you be more specific on where you found this? Both the FreeAXP and Avanti emulators are EV4 (AlphaServer 400) emulation. Maybe in this case the chip version doesn't really matter but it would be nice to have something a little more modern.
For a DS10 class emulator with up to 3GB of memory and lots of disk space I'd go up to $100 US. Otherwise I'm just as happy to run my DS20E or XP1000.
John H. Reinhardt
On 4/4/12 5:21 PM, Sampsa Laine wrote:
Guys,
I've just been talking to the guys who make the FreeAXP product about possible hobbyist pricing for their DS10 and other commercial products - they seemed to like what we're doing with HECnet and asked what I thought was a fair price for a DS10 emulator, so I figured I'd ask here.
Basically, I think we can get a better deal if a bunch of us buy a copy. Their list price for the DS10 version is USD 6,000 which of course is crazy as we can get a lot of hardware for that kind of money.
So I guess my questions are these:
1. How many of you are interested in a commercial Alpha emulator at hobbyist pricing?
2. What are we willing to pay for say an emulated DS10?
Sampsa
PS: The chap mentioned that hecnet.eu has been down for a while (so he's clearly aware of us) - any ideas when/if it's coming back up?
Kari,
Do you have a download link for this? I couldn't find it on their site, going to give it a try on my system, see what the performance is like...
Sampsa
On 5 Apr 2012, at 10:15, Kari Uusim ki wrote:
Sampsa,
Have you tested the PersonalAlpha or the CHARON -AXP/ES40 for Linux NCE?
They are both freeware and fully functional even though some restricted features.
Regards,
Kari
On 5.4.2012 9:43, Sampsa Laine wrote:
Well, I've told the guys that 50 euros is probably a realistic price that we as a community would be willing to part with.
The guy I'm in contact is really nice BTW, he's been watching out project for a while, even noted that hecnet.eu had been down since Friday...
Sampsa
On 5 Apr 2012, at 09:38, Sampsa Laine wrote:
I was thinking 50-100 GBP max myself - as these guys would have to probably physically post us a copy protection dongle.
For me, the power savings is the main issue: I already have a chunky i86_64 box that run various VMs and emulators, so I would probably save the 100 quid in about 3 months.
Sampsa
On 5 Apr 2012, at 09:35, Saku Set l wrote:
Yeah, I agree 50e max.
.
Here's the SPD: http://www.migrationspecialties.com/pdf/Avanti_SPD.pdf
Sampsa
On 5 Apr 2012, at 11:07, John H. Reinhardt wrote:
I looked on the Migration Specialties web site and found FreeAXP and Avanti but no mention of a DS10 emulation. Can you be more specific on where you found this? Both the FreeAXP and Avanti emulators are EV4 (AlphaServer 400) emulation. Maybe in this case the chip version doesn't really matter but it would be nice to have something a little more modern.
For a DS10 class emulator with up to 3GB of memory and lots of disk space I'd go up to $100 US. Otherwise I'm just as happy to run my DS20E or XP1000.
John H. Reinhardt
On 4/4/12 5:21 PM, Sampsa Laine wrote:
Guys,
I've just been talking to the guys who make the FreeAXP product about possible hobbyist pricing for their DS10 and other commercial products - they seemed to like what we're doing with HECnet and asked what I thought was a fair price for a DS10 emulator, so I figured I'd ask here.
Basically, I think we can get a better deal if a bunch of us buy a copy. Their list price for the DS10 version is USD 6,000 which of course is crazy as we can get a lot of hardware for that kind of money.
So I guess my questions are these:
1. How many of you are interested in a commercial Alpha emulator at hobbyist pricing?
2. What are we willing to pay for say an emulated DS10?
Sampsa
PS: The chap mentioned that hecnet.eu has been down for a while (so he's clearly aware of us) - any ideas when/if it's coming back up?
My bad, I thought I saw a DS10 emulator on their pricing list, I misread it...
They support up to 3 GB of RAM and 1 TB disks on their biggest product though, but it's an EV4 processor..
Sampsa
On 5 Apr 2012, at 11:07, John H. Reinhardt wrote:
I looked on the Migration Specialties web site and found FreeAXP and Avanti but no mention of a DS10 emulation. Can you be more specific on where you found this? Both the FreeAXP and Avanti emulators are EV4 (AlphaServer 400) emulation. Maybe in this case the chip version doesn't really matter but it would be nice to have something a little more modern.
For a DS10 class emulator with up to 3GB of memory and lots of disk space I'd go up to $100 US. Otherwise I'm just as happy to run my DS20E or XP1000.
John H. Reinhardt
On 4/4/12 5:21 PM, Sampsa Laine wrote:
Guys,
I've just been talking to the guys who make the FreeAXP product about possible hobbyist pricing for their DS10 and other commercial products - they seemed to like what we're doing with HECnet and asked what I thought was a fair price for a DS10 emulator, so I figured I'd ask here.
Basically, I think we can get a better deal if a bunch of us buy a copy. Their list price for the DS10 version is USD 6,000 which of course is crazy as we can get a lot of hardware for that kind of money.
So I guess my questions are these:
1. How many of you are interested in a commercial Alpha emulator at hobbyist pricing?
2. What are we willing to pay for say an emulated DS10?
Sampsa
PS: The chap mentioned that hecnet.eu has been down for a while (so he's clearly aware of us) - any ideas when/if it's coming back up?
I looked on the Migration Specialties web site and found FreeAXP and Avanti but no mention of a DS10 emulation. Can you be more specific on where you found this? Both the FreeAXP and Avanti emulators are EV4 (AlphaServer 400) emulation. Maybe in this case the chip version doesn't really matter but it would be nice to have something a little more modern.
For a DS10 class emulator with up to 3GB of memory and lots of disk space I'd go up to $100 US. Otherwise I'm just as happy to run my DS20E or XP1000.
John H. Reinhardt
On 4/4/12 5:21 PM, Sampsa Laine wrote:
Guys,
I've just been talking to the guys who make the FreeAXP product about possible hobbyist pricing for their DS10 and other commercial products - they seemed to like what we're doing with HECnet and asked what I thought was a fair price for a DS10 emulator, so I figured I'd ask here.
Basically, I think we can get a better deal if a bunch of us buy a copy. Their list price for the DS10 version is USD 6,000 which of course is crazy as we can get a lot of hardware for that kind of money.
So I guess my questions are these:
1. How many of you are interested in a commercial Alpha emulator at hobbyist pricing?
2. What are we willing to pay for say an emulated DS10?
Sampsa
PS: The chap mentioned that hecnet.eu has been down for a while (so he's clearly aware of us) - any ideas when/if it's coming back up?
Ohhh, the ES40 NCE looks pretty cool actually.
PersonalAlpha and FreeAXP are too limited due to the 128 MB max RAM, but ES40 might be a decent replacement.
Sampsa
On 5 Apr 2012, at 10:15, Kari Uusim ki wrote:
Sampsa,
Have you tested the PersonalAlpha or the CHARON -AXP/ES40 for Linux NCE?
They are both freeware and fully functional even though some restricted features.
Regards,
Kari
On 5.4.2012 9:43, Sampsa Laine wrote:
Well, I've told the guys that 50 euros is probably a realistic price that we as a community would be willing to part with.
The guy I'm in contact is really nice BTW, he's been watching out project for a while, even noted that hecnet.eu had been down since Friday...
Sampsa
On 5 Apr 2012, at 09:38, Sampsa Laine wrote:
I was thinking 50-100 GBP max myself - as these guys would have to probably physically post us a copy protection dongle.
For me, the power savings is the main issue: I already have a chunky i86_64 box that run various VMs and emulators, so I would probably save the 100 quid in about 3 months.
Sampsa
On 5 Apr 2012, at 09:35, Saku Set l wrote:
Yeah, I agree 50e max.
.
I told the guy that as we are both a) not exactly flush with cash and b) quite attached to actual hardware, they're unlikely to get much cash out of us.
However, from the get go he seems to approach this from a charity / marketing opportunity (I for one would stick a banner + link on the CHIMPY page as a part of the deal quite happily). Also, look at it this way: If he can sell it more or less at cost (i.e. USB dongle + shipping), he doesn't LOSE anything - we were never going to pay 6 kilodollars for an emu when hardware costs 200.
Sampsa
On 5 Apr 2012, at 10:16, hvlems at zonnet.nl wrote:
The vendor might feel somewhat offended by our response because 50 is a *lot* lower than the published marketing price. However we're hobbyist users who run VMS for various reasons. A hobby is run on a different (usually non rational) set of decisions than a business is.
The other thing is that the Alpha business by nature is about to end for commercial users. So the vendor may find the help of ambassadors useful.
Hans
The vendor might feel somewhat offended by our response because 50 is a *lot* lower than the published marketing price. However we're hobbyist users who run VMS for various reasons. A hobby is run on a different (usually non rational) set of decisions than a business is.
The other thing is that the Alpha business by nature is about to end for commercial users. So the vendor may find the help of ambassadors useful.
Hans
-----Original Message-----
From: Sampsa Laine <sampsa at mac.com>
Sender: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2012 09:43:57
To: <hecnet at Update.UU.SE>
Reply-To: hecnet at Update.UU.SESubject: Re: [HECnet] Alpha emulation
Well, I've told the guys that 50 euros is probably a realistic price that we as a community would be willing to part with.
The guy I'm in contact is really nice BTW, he's been watching out project for a while, even noted that hecnet.eu had been down since Friday...
Sampsa
On 5 Apr 2012, at 09:38, Sampsa Laine wrote:
I was thinking 50-100 GBP max myself - as these guys would have to probably physically post us a copy protection dongle.
For me, the power savings is the main issue: I already have a chunky i86_64 box that run various VMs and emulators, so I would probably save the 100 quid in about 3 months.
Sampsa
On 5 Apr 2012, at 09:35, Saku Set l wrote:
Yeah, I agree 50e max.
Sampsa,
Have you tested the PersonalAlpha or the CHARON -AXP/ES40 for Linux NCE?
They are both freeware and fully functional even though some restricted features.
Regards,
Kari
On 5.4.2012 9:43, Sampsa Laine wrote:
Well, I've told the guys that 50 euros is probably a realistic price that we as a community would be willing to part with.
The guy I'm in contact is really nice BTW, he's been watching out project for a while, even noted that hecnet.eu had been down since Friday...
Sampsa
On 5 Apr 2012, at 09:38, Sampsa Laine wrote:
I was thinking 50-100 GBP max myself - as these guys would have to probably physically post us a copy protection dongle.
For me, the power savings is the main issue: I already have a chunky i86_64 box that run various VMs and emulators, so I would probably save the 100 quid in about 3 months.
Sampsa
On 5 Apr 2012, at 09:35, Saku Set l wrote:
Yeah, I agree 50e max.
.
