HECnet

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15586 discussions

by bqt＠softjar.se

On 2012-06-08 16:39, Paul_Koning at Dell.com wrote: On Jun 8, 2012, at 3:00 AM, Johnny Billquist wrote: On 2012-06-08 08:39, Boyanich, Alastair wrote: Hi Johnny, Your welcome. Yes, it's pretty chatty. MIPSPro and DECC are my favourite C compilers as they're quite anal and chatty warning wise. Yeah. gcc is stupid. They added -Wall several years ago, but apparently people got upset by it's anal reporting, so they dumbed it down. So -Wall does not turn on all warnings anymore. And I just don't have the enery right now to figure out what more switches I should throw on it to actually make it complain about everything... If you really want lots of warnings, say -Wall -Wpedantic. But in fact -Wall is quite good in more recent versions of gcc. The issues mentioned before would certainly be caught by GCC 4.6 or later. Well, with one caveat: quite a number of the things that gcc can warn about are found as a consequence of the deeper analysis done when you turn on optimization. So you need at least -O1 and more likely -O2 if you want to get good warnings. Actually, I didn't get any warnings with -Wall, for which the mips compiler complained about. (Well, I had already fixed two issues, but the others gcc didn't complain about.) Thanks, however. It was -Wpendantic that I was thinking of, even though I never seem to be able to remember the name. But I still think it is backwards to have a -Wall, which do not enable all warnings. :-) Johnny

13 years, 6 months

promiscuous mode, was Re: [HECnet] Multinet Tunnel Connections to SG1::

by Paul_Koning＠Dell.com

On Jun 8, 2012, at 2:00 AM, Johnny Billquist wrote: On 2012-06-08 01:13, Dave McGuire wrote: On 06/07/2012 08:16 AM, Johnny Billquist wrote: Any program that needs access to raw ethernet packets needs to run as root. Promiscuous mode or not. Promiscuous mode itself has little to do with this. So if you want to run anything like a bridge or a router, you will need to run it as root. Promiscuous mode is basically just allowing you to share the same interface as the system is otherwise using, instead of having to dedicate a separate ethernet interface for this. Maybe you're just putting this another way, but promiscuous mode is correctly defined a bit differently than this. When an Ethernet controller is placed into promiscuous mode, its on-chip MAC address filters, which normally either select or ignore inbound packets based on their MAC address, are disabled. ALL packets are received by the hardware and passed to the Ethernet driver in the OS, rather than only the ones destined for that specific interface as defined by its MAC address. I'm reasonably certain that you know this but were just explaining it in a more abstract way...? Yes. Well, actually I wasn't describing it in a more abstract way, but in a way more in terms of why you need promiscuous mode instead of what it actually does on the interface. But reading it through now, I see that there was one implicit assumption in my text which I could have pointed out. If you need to share the device with the system, while using a different MAC address, you need to place the device in promiscuous mode. And such is the case if we talk DECnet, since DECnet requires that you use a specific MAC address which is not the same as the default MAC address of a device. That's true if you have a NIC and driver that only allows one individual address per physical MAC. Most modern NICs allow multiple individual addresses since the address filter is an exact match on N (say, 16 or so) addresses, and it doesn't care whether those are individual or multicast. The host OS drivers may or may not export that feature. If they do, then you don't need promiscuous mode. If they don't, or if the NIC is old enough that it can't do this, then you do. paul

13 years, 6 months

New bridge.c feedback

by Paul_Koning＠Dell.com

On Jun 8, 2012, at 3:00 AM, Johnny Billquist wrote: On 2012-06-08 08:39, Boyanich, Alastair wrote: Hi Johnny, Your welcome. Yes, it's pretty chatty. MIPSPro and DECC are my favourite C compilers as they're quite anal and chatty warning wise. Yeah. gcc is stupid. They added -Wall several years ago, but apparently people got upset by it's anal reporting, so they dumbed it down. So -Wall does not turn on all warnings anymore. And I just don't have the enery right now to figure out what more switches I should throw on it to actually make it complain about everything... If you really want lots of warnings, say -Wall -Wpedantic. But in fact -Wall is quite good in more recent versions of gcc. The issues mentioned before would certainly be caught by GCC 4.6 or later. Well, with one caveat: quite a number of the things that gcc can warn about are found as a consequence of the deeper analysis done when you turn on optimization. So you need at least -O1 and more likely -O2 if you want to get good warnings. paul

13 years, 6 months

Introducing myself... and my little network

by pechter＠gmail.com

On Thu, Jun 7, 2012 at 7:14 PM, Dave McGuire <mcguire at neurotica.com> wrote: On 06/07/2012 08:35 AM, Jordi Guillaumes i Pons wrote: According to this: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/os/openvms-release-history.html Support for the 4000/90 came in version 5.5-2 (1992). The 3300 was supported in 5.0-2 and the 4000 mod. 2000 in 5.4-2. So none of my real boxen can run 4.7. Well you've gotta find yourself some more machines! 11/750s are probably the most common of the 4.x-capable machines, though there don't seem to be many left floating around. Heh, then I would have to find also a new home and probably an attorney to handle de divorce demand ;) I'll keep my mouth shut.. ;) -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA My wife refers to the 11/7xx boxes I worked on as my old girlfriends. If one more piece of hardware hits the house I'll need the same lawyer. As soon as I can find it a good home I'm getting rid of my Vaxstation and going to go to only emulated hardware under VMware Workstation/ESXi/XenServer at home. Bill Pechter, N2RDI Holmdel, NJ -- d|i|g|i|t|a|l had it THEN. Don't you wish you could still buy it now! pechter-at-gmail.com

13 years, 6 months

lunchbox VAXen, was Re: [HECnet] Introducing myself... and my little network

by pechter＠gmail.com

On Thu, Jun 7, 2012 at 7:42 PM, Bob Armstrong <bob at jfcl.com> wrote: Lunchboxes! :-) And there are images for new boot ROMs available for those which will allow you to boot from the on-board SCSI host adapter, ... I've heard of this, but I haven't seen it. As I recall, the onboard SCSI adapter uses programmed I/O (no DMA!) so it's really slow. For a TK50 nobody would ever notice, but for the system disk it's a problem. Better to cluster boot one, diskless. FWIW, an RD54 isn't necessary. The 2000 can easily be convinced to use _any_ MFM drive, DEC or not. You can get VMS V4 on a 30 meg drive, maybe even 20, if you're determined. Long ago I wrote up a little description of all the VS 2000 disk formatter parameters, what they meant, and how to fake them for non-DEC drives. Google ancient Usenet postings if you're interested. Bob The real problem I've found lately is getting VMS V4 or V3. I used to do installs of V2, V3, and V4 when I was at DEC. It is really hard to find VMS installation media of the pre CD variety. We really could use an archive site for stuff like this, but HP would probably have a fit over the copyright. Unfortunately, getting a legal archive will probably not happen. Bill -- d|i|g|i|t|a|l had it THEN. Don't you wish you could still buy it now! pechter-at-gmail.com

13 years, 6 months

netowrk flapping....

by bob＠jfcl.com

We (all of us with Multinet, I think) see this problem occasionally. AFAIK no one has come up with an adequate explanation, let alone a solution. You can always turn off logging if it bothers you :-) Bob

13 years, 6 months

Introducing myself... and my little network

by md.benson＠gmail.com

On 8 Jun 2012, at 10:58, Johnny Billquist <bqt at softjar.se> wrote: Yes, a TZ87 (DLT2000) can read TK50 tapes and TK70 tapes as well. Really? That is even better. I had a fleeting memory of the TZ87, but I just assumed I must be remembering wrong. That lines up, my DLT4000 is a TZ88 and won't, was the first DLT that didn't read them IIRC -- Mark Benson http://markbenson.org/blog http://twitter.com/MDBenson

13 years, 6 months

lunchbox VAXen, was Re: [HECnet] Introducing myself... and my little network

by HECNET＠beyondthepale.ie

Lunchboxes! :-) And there are images for new boot ROMs available for those which will allow you to boot from the on-board SCSI host adapter, which is relatively slow (NCR5380-based) but still less painful than trying to find, and then afford to purchase, an RD54. I think someone even wrote a driver for VMS to use disks on that controller. I have several of those machines; I really should look into that. Does anyone have any further information on, or actual copies of, those boot ROMs and/or the VMS device driver? That's a patch for VAX/VMS 5.5-2 called PK2KDRVR which Wolfgang Moeller wrote in response to the moaning years ago on comp.os.vms etc that the VS2000 would be so much more useful if it could use SCSI disks. To his surprise, he found there was very little interest in his solution. I was interested and I found the patched driver worked well. I found I couldn't tell if it was slow or not as the 2000 is so slow anyway! I never tried the patched boot ROMs as I boot my 2000's from a 3100. (How come I can remember this stuff and I have trouble remembering what happened yesterday!) Wolfgang also did patches for VS3100 boot ROMs which had problems booting disks over 1GB in size. I also have another patch he wrote which makes the floppy driver in a 2000 treat the drive as an RX23 instead of an RX33 making it possible for VMS to correctly access 3.5in disks in a 2000. I've put what I have on CEIRE:: (I can't find the original PK2KDRVR.ZIP so I've just zipped up the contents of my PK2KDRVR directory which is likely what I got when I unzipped the original zip file...) Regards, Peter Coghlan.

13 years, 6 months

Introducing myself... and my little network

by bqt＠softjar.se

On 2012-06-08 11:10, Kari Uusim ki wrote: On 8.6.2012 10:31, Mark Benson wrote: On 8 Jun 2012, at 08:23, Dave McGuire<mcguire at neurotica.com> wrote: I haven't tried cleaning TK50 heads in years, but I will (now that I have a more respectable workspace) start trying that. I will let you know how things go. I'll probably start digging into those within the next month or two. Thank you for the suggestion! I take it TK50 tapes won't read in a later drive? Yes, a TZ87 (DLT2000) can read TK50 tapes and TK70 tapes as well. Really? That is even better. I had a fleeting memory of the TZ87, but I just assumed I must be remembering wrong. Johnny

13 years, 6 months

Introducing myself... and my little network

by bqt＠softjar.se

On 2012-06-08 11:10, Dave McGuire wrote: On 06/08/2012 05:08 AM, Mark Benson wrote: The TK85 can read TK50s? I didn't know that! If that's the case, it's likely that the TF85 (DSSI version) may as well, and I have one of those. That may be one more option to get my huge pile of TK50s read. I had a feeling the later TKs read TK50. I read it on on of HP's DLT compatibility docs but couldn't remember if it was TK50 or TK70 that was the oldest compatible format. I have a SCSI-II DLT4000 drive (TK88 or 89??) and I know that doesn't read any old TK tapes, only DLT1,2 etc. The general rule with most of those format is that the current drive will read and write the current format, and read (but not write) the previous format. There are of course exceptions, but not many. Indeed. Such as the Tx85 reading both TK50 and TK70. :-) Johnny

13 years, 6 months

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