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DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats

by robert.jarratt＠ntlworld.com

-----Original Message----- From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Paul_Koning at Dell.com Sent: 22 June 2012 22:25 To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE Subject: Re: [HECnet] DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats On Jun 22, 2012, at 4:07 PM, Rob Jarratt wrote: DDCMP over some kind of serial line? Would need appropriate hardware and driver code to work against that. DDCMP over sync, yes. But DDCMP also works on an async line, and that just requires protocol code that can talk to a raw mode TTY device. That would work for what I need -- I have async DDCMP on my PRO-380 running RSTS, and in fact it's a standard feature of some of the PDP11 DECnet products. (I'm not sure if it was ever official in DECnet/E, but the machinery is there in the latest versions of the kernel.) paul Hmmm, so if we can use async serial then we have a chance to add that to the router once I have had a chance to do the main part. It would be good to do something like that. I don't know enough about DDCMP yet to know what the implications are (can it work with a Version 2 router for example?). Regards Rob

13 years, 9 months

RSTS on a Pro, was Re: [HECnet] DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats

by Paul_Koning＠Dell.com

It's a midnight project, done while at DEC but not official. I did it first on RSTS 9.6, and in fact built a set of 3 or so floppies that can be used, along with a stock microRSTS kit, to install that on a Pro. I subsequently ported it to RSTS/E 10.1 but didn't repackage it as I did the first time. Yes, new drivers for sure. New interrupt handling, too. BTW, if you can write the correct bootstrap, the stock RSTS 9.6 INIT.SYS will boot on a Pro, because the PRO supports bits made it into the official sources as far as the init code goes. If you do, it will identify the machine type as a "GPK-350" or "GPK-380". :-) What's missing is CNA support (Ethernet). The chip used on that card sucks quite severely, and I've never had enough energy to write the driver. But I have disk, and display, and serial ports including the obscure 4-port card, DDCMP support in both sync and async mode... paul On Jun 22, 2012, at 5:28 PM, Dave McGuire wrote: On 06/22/2012 05:25 PM, Paul_Koning at Dell.com wrote: DDCMP over sync, yes. But DDCMP also works on an async line, and that just requires protocol code that can talk to a raw mode TTY device. That would work for what I need -- I have async DDCMP on my PRO-380 running RSTS, and in fact it's a standard feature of some of the PDP11 DECnet products. (I'm not sure if it was ever official in DECnet/E, but the machinery is there in the latest versions of the kernel.) Umm, hang on...RSTS on a Pro-380? I didn't think RSTS had drivers for the MFM controller in there, and I'm pretty sure the console I/O is very different as well. Please tell me more. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA

13 years, 9 months

RSTS on a Pro, was Re: [HECnet] DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On 06/22/2012 05:25 PM, Paul_Koning at Dell.com wrote: DDCMP over sync, yes. But DDCMP also works on an async line, and that just requires protocol code that can talk to a raw mode TTY device. That would work for what I need -- I have async DDCMP on my PRO-380 running RSTS, and in fact it's a standard feature of some of the PDP11 DECnet products. (I'm not sure if it was ever official in DECnet/E, but the machinery is there in the latest versions of the kernel.) Umm, hang on...RSTS on a Pro-380? I didn't think RSTS had drivers for the MFM controller in there, and I'm pretty sure the console I/O is very different as well. Please tell me more. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA

13 years, 9 months

DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats

by Paul_Koning＠Dell.com

On Jun 22, 2012, at 4:07 PM, Rob Jarratt wrote: DDCMP over some kind of serial line? Would need appropriate hardware and driver code to work against that. DDCMP over sync, yes. But DDCMP also works on an async line, and that just requires protocol code that can talk to a raw mode TTY device. That would work for what I need -- I have async DDCMP on my PRO-380 running RSTS, and in fact it's a standard feature of some of the PDP11 DECnet products. (I'm not sure if it was ever official in DECnet/E, but the machinery is there in the latest versions of the kernel.) paul

13 years, 9 months

DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats

by robert.jarratt＠ntlworld.com

-----Original Message----- From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Rob Jarratt Sent: 22 June 2012 20:27 To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE Subject: RE: [HECnet] DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats -----Original Message----- From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner- hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Dave McGuire Sent: 22 June 2012 19:34 To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE Subject: Re: [HECnet] DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats On 06/22/2012 02:31 PM, Rob Jarratt wrote: I am making a little progress on a user mode DECnet router that will run on Raspberry Pi and on Windows. There is still a long way to go, but I want to get the basic design right in terms on the network interfacing. Can someone tell me how Cisco and Multinet encapsulate DECnet packets sent over the internet? Ciscos can encapsulate DECnet within either GRE or L2TP. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA I hope GRE and L2TP aren't too complex. It *looks* like GRE can be transported over UDP. L2TP looks a bit more complex, but I have skimmed the Wikipedia page for all of 15 seconds so I may have missed something. Regards Rob Sorry, just realised that is silly, if I am correct GRE is another protocol type at the same level as UDP. I was confusing IP with UDP! Regards Rob

13 years, 9 months

DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats

by robert.jarratt＠ntlworld.com

-----Original Message----- From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Paul_Koning at Dell.com Sent: 22 June 2012 20:37 To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE Subject: Re: [HECnet] DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats On Jun 22, 2012, at 3:28 PM, Rob Jarratt wrote: -----Original Message----- From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner- hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Paul_Koning at Dell.com Sent: 22 June 2012 19:44 To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE Subject: Re: [HECnet] DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats Are you planning to have it speak unencapsulated, too? That would be nice for talking to real DECnet nodes. paul On Jun 22, 2012, at 2:31 PM, Rob Jarratt wrote: I am making a little progress on a user mode DECnet router that will run on Raspberry Pi and on Windows. There is still a long way to go, but I want to get the basic design right in terms on the network interfacing. Can someone tell me how Cisco and Multinet encapsulate DECnet packets sent over the internet? Thanks Rob Yes, that should be the simplest one. For that I am assuming that the router would be connected directly to the Ethernet segment, not missing anything am I? Regards Rob Right, that's what I had in mind. An Ethernet segment with a PDP11 on it along with your creation. Extra credit would be support of point to point links... which I could actually use, since my current PDP11 speaks DDCMP but not yet Ethernet (no driver for its NIC yet). That's off the wall enough that I wouldn't expect you to do it, but I would probably take it on as an additional feature. paul DDCMP over some kind of serial line? Would need appropriate hardware and driver code to work against that. Regards Rob

13 years, 9 months

DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats

by Paul_Koning＠Dell.com

On Jun 22, 2012, at 3:28 PM, Rob Jarratt wrote: -----Original Message----- From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Paul_Koning at Dell.com Sent: 22 June 2012 19:44 To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE Subject: Re: [HECnet] DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats Are you planning to have it speak unencapsulated, too? That would be nice for talking to real DECnet nodes. paul On Jun 22, 2012, at 2:31 PM, Rob Jarratt wrote: I am making a little progress on a user mode DECnet router that will run on Raspberry Pi and on Windows. There is still a long way to go, but I want to get the basic design right in terms on the network interfacing. Can someone tell me how Cisco and Multinet encapsulate DECnet packets sent over the internet? Thanks Rob Yes, that should be the simplest one. For that I am assuming that the router would be connected directly to the Ethernet segment, not missing anything am I? Regards Rob Right, that's what I had in mind. An Ethernet segment with a PDP11 on it along with your creation. Extra credit would be support of point to point links... which I could actually use, since my current PDP11 speaks DDCMP but not yet Ethernet (no driver for its NIC yet). That's off the wall enough that I wouldn't expect you to do it, but I would probably take it on as an additional feature. paul

13 years, 9 months

DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats

by robert.jarratt＠ntlworld.com

-----Original Message----- From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Paul_Koning at Dell.com Sent: 22 June 2012 19:44 To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE Subject: Re: [HECnet] DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats Are you planning to have it speak unencapsulated, too? That would be nice for talking to real DECnet nodes. paul On Jun 22, 2012, at 2:31 PM, Rob Jarratt wrote: I am making a little progress on a user mode DECnet router that will run on Raspberry Pi and on Windows. There is still a long way to go, but I want to get the basic design right in terms on the network interfacing. Can someone tell me how Cisco and Multinet encapsulate DECnet packets sent over the internet? Thanks Rob Yes, that should be the simplest one. For that I am assuming that the router would be connected directly to the Ethernet segment, not missing anything am I? Regards Rob

13 years, 9 months

DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats

by robert.jarratt＠ntlworld.com

-----Original Message----- From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Dave McGuire Sent: 22 June 2012 19:34 To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE Subject: Re: [HECnet] DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats On 06/22/2012 02:31 PM, Rob Jarratt wrote: I am making a little progress on a user mode DECnet router that will run on Raspberry Pi and on Windows. There is still a long way to go, but I want to get the basic design right in terms on the network interfacing. Can someone tell me how Cisco and Multinet encapsulate DECnet packets sent over the internet? Ciscos can encapsulate DECnet within either GRE or L2TP. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA I hope GRE and L2TP aren't too complex. It *looks* like GRE can be transported over UDP. L2TP looks a bit more complex, but I have skimmed the Wikipedia page for all of 15 seconds so I may have missed something. Regards Rob

13 years, 9 months

DECnet User Mode Router - Encapsulation Formats

by Paul_Koning＠Dell.com

Are you planning to have it speak unencapsulated, too? That would be nice for talking to real DECnet nodes. paul On Jun 22, 2012, at 2:31 PM, Rob Jarratt wrote: I am making a little progress on a user mode DECnet router that will run on Raspberry Pi and on Windows. There is still a long way to go, but I want to get the basic design right in terms on the network interfacing. Can someone tell me how Cisco and Multinet encapsulate DECnet packets sent over the internet? Thanks Rob

13 years, 9 months

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