On Apr 29, 2012, at 4:14, Kari Uusim ki <uusimaki at exdecfinland.org> wrote:
DECnet must have been around at least from 1993, because the DECbrouter90's, which were practically Cisco routers in a DEChub90 module, were introduced in 1993. And they used IOS.
What I haven't found out is when the IP tunnels were introduced in the IOS. It seems to be in IOS 11.2. So it is included in all recent versions, but the Cisco 2500's have limited flash and RAM capabilites. Therefore the recent IOS's cannot be used with older hardware. I suppose the IOS 11.2 should be sufficient for tunneling DECnet over IP.
The 2500s can easily run 12.
I have to check which versions I have on my 2500's. Most probably they have an IP-only version of the IOS. I bought the 2500's cheap from a local broker a few years ago.
There are a handful of versions that have DECnet. It's likely you have ip only though but who knows. Either way, we can get you what you need.
Regards,
Kari
On 29.4.2012 9:27, hvlems at zonnet.nl wrote:
We used a Cisco MGS in a project to connect a token ring network to the plant ethernet. The only protocol used on both LAN's was DECnet. The MGS box acted as a phase IV circuit router. This was in 1993. IIRC the DECnet implementation was quite new and we encountered a couple of minor problems.
So I guess that DECnet is available on anything you have running.
Hans
-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Hechinger<wonko at 4amlunch.net>
Sender: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2012 21:06:51
To:<hecnet at Update.UU.SE>
Reply-To: hecnet at Update.UU.SESubject: Re: [HECnet] GRE tunnel working!
On 4/28/2012 2:49 PM, Dave McGuire wrote:
On 04/28/2012 02:38 PM, Brian Hechinger wrote:
I would be extremely surprised to find that both GRE and DECnet weren't to be found in 11 let alone 12. It's more likely to be a feature set issue.
It's definitely a feature set issue. The last time I did anything
with GRE (before this anyway) was between a 2501 and an AGS+; the former
was running IOS 10 and the latter 11. DECnet support in IOS goes back a
good bit before that, which shouldn't be surprising given the history
(and reason for existence) of Cisco.
I don't think getting GRE support should be an issue, I believe that's
included in all versions, you just have to make sure you get the right
version for DECnet.
Cisco has a feature navigator tool on their website. That can be used to figure it out.
I've not tried that yet. That sounds very handy.
http://tools.cisco.com/ITDIT/CFN/jsp/index.jsp
The CCIE at work pointed me to that. Very helpful.
-brian
On 2012-04-29 10:41, Peter Lothberg wrote:
On 04/28/2012 09:07 PM, Peter Lothberg wrote:
I have three cisco boxes for my DECnet and would be happy to do a
GRE tunnel..
Peter! It's great to see you in this gang. It has been a long time;
I hope you're doing well. Drop me a note sometime and let me know
what's been going on over there.
I live in Sunnyvale, CA since 1997... -:)
If you and Brian and I set up three tunnels between us, will IOS do
spanning tree between them?
Spanning_Tree? This is the distater that Jonny started with ethnernet
bridges..... (on the other hand without that there would be no HECNet
so I'll be quiet, I just wish he changed it to do l2tvp3, don't need
to do the signalling just the encap..) (it don't solve the loop
problem, but now a c router could terminate a Jonny tunnel..)
I'm definitely not boasting about the bridge. :-) It is a hack. But it's much better than the first hack I did for HECnet (which was basically transporting a serial stream point-to-point, and setting up DECnet with a asynch serial port doing DDCMP).
I've not heard of l2tvp3 before. Might be worth checking in to. But the biggest issue really is the looping. And I'm too lazy to implement stp... Well, I might get the inspiration one day, but I'm way more interested in writing stuff for RSX.
DECnet-4 has a link-state routing protocol, it's what Radia did before
IS-IS, it has L1 and L2 routing decided by the area number.
Funny you should mention that, as I always thought IS-IS looked rather a lot like the DECnet routing.
So, as long as the tunnels are PTP between routers it will do DECnet
routing, and the metric is cost and hops (look at a ethnernet routing
vector it's indexed with node number and has cost,hop in 16 bits..)
In short, do nothing, set metric to 10 all all over the place and it
will just work.
What is your IP address? Mine are on the HECnet mailinglinst.
Letting the Cisco partiticpate as routers on DECnet is really the best way to go.
Johnny
--
Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
|| on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt at softjar.se || Reading murder books
pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
On 04/28/2012 09:07 PM, Peter Lothberg wrote:
I have three cisco boxes for my DECnet and would be happy to do a
GRE tunnel..
Peter! It's great to see you in this gang. It has been a long time;
I hope you're doing well. Drop me a note sometime and let me know
what's been going on over there.
I live in Sunnyvale, CA since 1997... -:)
If you and Brian and I set up three tunnels between us, will IOS do
spanning tree between them?
Spanning_Tree? This is the distater that Jonny started with ethnernet
bridges..... (on the other hand without that there would be no HECNet
so I'll be quiet, I just wish he changed it to do l2tvp3, don't need
to do the signalling just the encap..) (it don't solve the loop
problem, but now a c router could terminate a Jonny tunnel..)
DECnet-4 has a link-state routing protocol, it's what Radia did before
IS-IS, it has L1 and L2 routing decided by the area number.
So, as long as the tunnels are PTP between routers it will do DECnet
routing, and the metric is cost and hops (look at a ethnernet routing
vector it's indexed with node number and has cost,hop in 16 bits..)
In short, do nothing, set metric to 10 all all over the place and it
will just work.
What is your IP address? Mine are on the HECnet mailinglinst.
-P w4kel/sm4kel
What IP address(es) should I point my tunnel(s) at?
Install 2 tunnels:
Reston VA 59.59:
interface Tunnel4000
decnet cost 10
tunnel source 199.0.131.2
tunnel destination 216.15.64.181
Stockholm Sweden 59.11:
interface Tunnel4000
decnet cost 10
tunnel source 192.108.200.213
tunnel destination 216.15.64.181
Thanks, -P
DECnet must have been around at least from 1993, because the DECbrouter90's, which were practically Cisco routers in a DEChub90 module, were introduced in 1993. And they used IOS.
What I haven't found out is when the IP tunnels were introduced in the IOS. It seems to be in IOS 11.2. So it is included in all recent versions, but the Cisco 2500's have limited flash and RAM capabilites. Therefore the recent IOS's cannot be used with older hardware. I suppose the IOS 11.2 should be sufficient for tunneling DECnet over IP.
I have to check which versions I have on my 2500's. Most probably they have an IP-only version of the IOS. I bought the 2500's cheap from a local broker a few years ago.
Regards,
Kari
On 29.4.2012 9:27, hvlems at zonnet.nl wrote:
We used a Cisco MGS in a project to connect a token ring network to the plant ethernet. The only protocol used on both LAN's was DECnet. The MGS box acted as a phase IV circuit router. This was in 1993. IIRC the DECnet implementation was quite new and we encountered a couple of minor problems.
So I guess that DECnet is available on anything you have running.
Hans
-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Hechinger<wonko at 4amlunch.net>
Sender: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2012 21:06:51
To:<hecnet at Update.UU.SE>
Reply-To: hecnet at Update.UU.SESubject: Re: [HECnet] GRE tunnel working!
On 4/28/2012 2:49 PM, Dave McGuire wrote:
On 04/28/2012 02:38 PM, Brian Hechinger wrote:
I would be extremely surprised to find that both GRE and DECnet weren't to be found in 11 let alone 12. It's more likely to be a feature set issue.
It's definitely a feature set issue. The last time I did anything
with GRE (before this anyway) was between a 2501 and an AGS+; the former
was running IOS 10 and the latter 11. DECnet support in IOS goes back a
good bit before that, which shouldn't be surprising given the history
(and reason for existence) of Cisco.
I don't think getting GRE support should be an issue, I believe that's
included in all versions, you just have to make sure you get the right
version for DECnet.
Cisco has a feature navigator tool on their website. That can be used to figure it out.
I've not tried that yet. That sounds very handy.
http://tools.cisco.com/ITDIT/CFN/jsp/index.jsp
The CCIE at work pointed me to that. Very helpful.
-brian
We used a Cisco MGS in a project to connect a token ring network to the plant ethernet. The only protocol used on both LAN's was DECnet. The MGS box acted as a phase IV circuit router. This was in 1993. IIRC the DECnet implementation was quite new and we encountered a couple of minor problems.
So I guess that DECnet is available on anything you have running.
Hans
-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Hechinger <wonko at 4amlunch.net>
Sender: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2012 21:06:51
To: <hecnet at Update.UU.SE>
Reply-To: hecnet at Update.UU.SESubject: Re: [HECnet] GRE tunnel working!
On 4/28/2012 2:49 PM, Dave McGuire wrote:
On 04/28/2012 02:38 PM, Brian Hechinger wrote:
I would be extremely surprised to find that both GRE and DECnet weren't to be found in 11 let alone 12. It's more likely to be a feature set issue.
It's definitely a feature set issue. The last time I did anything
with GRE (before this anyway) was between a 2501 and an AGS+; the former
was running IOS 10 and the latter 11. DECnet support in IOS goes back a
good bit before that, which shouldn't be surprising given the history
(and reason for existence) of Cisco.
I don't think getting GRE support should be an issue, I believe that's
included in all versions, you just have to make sure you get the right
version for DECnet.
Cisco has a feature navigator tool on their website. That can be used to figure it out.
I've not tried that yet. That sounds very handy.
http://tools.cisco.com/ITDIT/CFN/jsp/index.jsp
The CCIE at work pointed me to that. Very helpful.
-brian
On 04/28/2012 09:57 PM, Brian Hechinger wrote:
I have three cisco boxes for my DECnet and would be happy to do a
GRE tunnel..
Peter! It's great to see you in this gang. It has been a long time;
I hope you're doing well. Drop me a note sometime and let me know
what's been going on over there.
If you and Brian and I set up three tunnels between us, will IOS do
spanning tree between them?
No, because they aren't switched ports.
It certainly comes into play when bridging, say when bridging across GRE.
DECnet, however, should do the right thing assuming we get our DECnet
costs setup correctly.
Ahh, that makes sense. DECnet over a WAN is a new thing for me. Fun
stuff!
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
On 4/28/2012 9:55 PM, Dave McGuire wrote:
On 04/28/2012 09:07 PM, Peter Lothberg wrote:
I have three cisco boxes for my DECnet and would be happy to do a
GRE tunnel..
Peter! It's great to see you in this gang. It has been a long time;
I hope you're doing well. Drop me a note sometime and let me know
what's been going on over there.
If you and Brian and I set up three tunnels between us, will IOS do
spanning tree between them?
-Dave
No, because they aren't switched ports.
DECnet, however, should do the right thing assuming we get our DECnet costs setup correctly.
-brian
On 04/28/2012 09:07 PM, Peter Lothberg wrote:
I have three cisco boxes for my DECnet and would be happy to do a
GRE tunnel..
Peter! It's great to see you in this gang. It has been a long time;
I hope you're doing well. Drop me a note sometime and let me know
what's been going on over there.
If you and Brian and I set up three tunnels between us, will IOS do
spanning tree between them?
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
On 04/28/2012 08:26 PM, Brian Hechinger wrote:
I'm interested in that option as well.
I have a couple of Cisco 2500's. Which IOS version is needed?
c2500-d-l (requires 8MB DRAM) - IP/IPX/AT/DEC feature set
or :
c2500-js-l (requires 16MB DRAM) ENTERPRISE PLUS feature set
both require 16MB Flash.
I can download both of them just as soon as Cisco fixes my CCO account.
AGAIN.
For the 6th or 7th time in 2-3 months.
This is getting rather annoying.
Yes. I happen to have those images; they're up at:
http://www.neurotica.com/misc/ios/
I'll leave them there for a few days.
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
