5 Nov
2018
5 Nov
'18
3:21 a.m.
Hi HECnet,
I am scouring the Internet for DECnet documentation (I've looked in
the usual places), does anyone have any of the DECnet for DOS or
DECnet for Rainbow documentation?
DECnet-Rainbow Installation Guide
DECnet-DOS Getting Started
DECnet-DOS User's Guide
DECnet-Rainbow Release Notes
DECnet-DOS Installation Guide
Also particularly interested in the version 1.1 of the software too
(we have 1.0 but it was significantly improved/updated with 1.1).
thanks,
nigel.
6 Nov
6 Nov
1:47 a.m.
There are some PATHWORKS packages at https://winworldpc.com/product/pathworks/ but I
didn't check to see if they include documentation.
Did you look on archive.org as well?
--
Jeffrey H. Johnson
jhj at trnsz.com
https://ban.ai/multics
On Nov 4, 2018, at 9:21 PM, Nigel Williams <nw at
retrocomputingtasmania.com> wrote:
Hi HECnet,
I am scouring the Internet for DECnet documentation (I've looked in
the usual places), does anyone have any of the DECnet for DOS or
DECnet for Rainbow documentation?
DECnet-Rainbow Installation Guide
DECnet-DOS Getting Started
DECnet-DOS User's Guide
DECnet-Rainbow Release Notes
DECnet-DOS Installation Guide
Also particularly interested in the version 1.1 of the software too
(we have 1.0 but it was significantly improved/updated with 1.1).
thanks,
nigel.
5:34 a.m.
Hello!
Our friends at Bit Savers also maintains a repository of such stuffs,
but like Jeffrey says about back there I don't know if Bit Savers also
maintains the documentation for the stuffs as well.
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8 at gmail.com
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."
On Mon, Nov 5, 2018 at 7:47 PM Jeffrey H. Johnson <jhj at trnsz.com> wrote:
There are some PATHWORKS packages at https://winworldpc.com/product/pathworks/ but I
didn't check to see if they include documentation.
Did you look on archive.org as well?
--
Jeffrey H. Johnson
jhj at trnsz.com
https://ban.ai/multics
On Nov 4, 2018, at 9:21 PM, Nigel Williams <nw at retrocomputingtasmania.com>
wrote:
Hi HECnet,
I am scouring the Internet for DECnet documentation (I've looked in
the usual places), does anyone have any of the DECnet for DOS or
DECnet for Rainbow documentation?
DECnet-Rainbow Installation Guide
DECnet-DOS Getting Started
DECnet-DOS User's Guide
DECnet-Rainbow Release Notes
DECnet-DOS Installation Guide
Also particularly interested in the version 1.1 of the software too
(we have 1.0 but it was significantly improved/updated with 1.1).
thanks,
nigel.
And this message is being sponsored by the Paul Drake Detective Bureau
in the Brant Building in LA.
2:57 p.m.
I'm just curious - how did the DECnet for Rainbow connect? The DECnet/DOS that I
remember using required a 3Com ISA Ethernet card of some flavor, but AFAIK there was never
an Ethernet for Rainbow. Did DECnet/Rainbow use a DDCMP serial connection? Or some other
magic thing?
If DECnet/Rainbow is still around I'd like to get a copy. I have a Rainbow 100B and
DECnet would be a nice addition.
Thanks,
Bob
5:20 p.m.
On 11/6/18 8:57 AM, Robert Armstrong wrote:
I'm just curious - how did the DECnet for
Rainbow connect? The DECnet/DOS that I remember using required a 3Com ISA Ethernet card
of some flavor,
It requires a DEPCA. This is a DEC-produced 8-bit ISA board with (I
think) an 82586 Ethernet controller on it, along with, inexplicably, an
interface for a DEC puck mouse.
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
5:26 p.m.
On 11/6/18 11:25 AM, Robert Armstrong wrote:
Yes, you mentioned that, on other than the Rainbow, it may have
required a 3Com card. That's what I was replying to. (which is why I
quoted it ;))
I don't know of any Ethernet interfaces for the Rainbow.
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
Dave McGuire
wrote:
It requires a DEPCA.
You're talking about a PC, right? I was interested in the Rainbow. You'd need
a big hammer to plug a DEPCA into a Rainbow...
7:43 p.m.
On 11/6/18 12:02 PM, Robert Armstrong wrote:
Oh really? I don't remember that. Interesting.
I had a DEPCA at the time, which worked nicely. I used the heck out
of DECnet-DOS back then.
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
it may have
required a 3Com card. That's what I was replying to.
Fair enough, but I'm pretty sure DECnet/DOS worked with a 3C501 as well. 
7:45 p.m.
On Nov 6, 2018, at 12:02 PM, Robert Armstrong <bob
at jfcl.com> wrote:
I'm afraid you're right, at least in some versions. Not very well, because that
interface is single buffered. So if two packets arrive close together, one is dropped.
Since no sane person would design an interface like that, we (DECnet architecture group)
adamantly refused to mess with the DECnet architecture to handle such interfaces.
paul
Dave McGuire wrote:
it may have required a 3Com card. That's what I was replying to.
Fair enough, but I'm pretty sure DECnet/DOS worked with a 3C501 as well.
Bob
10:41 p.m.
Paul Koning wrote:
I'm afraid you're right, at least in some versions. Not very well,
because
that
interface is single buffered.
I think the 3C501 was one of the very early ISA bus Ethernet cards, wasn't
it? It certainly preceded the DEPCA. At one place I worked in the mid-late
80s we had a bunch of the 3Com cards and used DECnet/DOS. I don't remember
having any serious problems with it, but we didn't have that much network
traffic. As they say, it was enough that the bear could dance at all; it
didn't matter that it couldn't dance well.
I was looking around and the README file in the archive for DECnet/DOS
v2.0 (it's on diskette #9) has some tips for tuning the 3C501 card, so it
clearly was supported in that release.
I also see that the release notes for DECnet/DOS v1.0 have a lot of stuff
about the Rainbow, but in v2.0 all mention of the Rainbow seems to have
disappeared. I guess that's when DEC dropped it and it's probably why I
never saw it before.
Bob
7 Nov
7 Nov
4:22 a.m.
I missed being specific in my original email, I was seeking version
1.1 of DECnet for Rainbow [1]
As everyone likely knows, but might have forgotten, the Rainbow was
incompatible with the IBM PC world for both communications and
graphics (there was software that fixed other differences assuming a
well-behaved DOS application). I would be glad to use DECnet over a
serial port on the Rainbow.
I had an idea there was a third-party Ethernet card for the Rainbow
but the Rainbow only has three expansion options keyed to specific
option types (hard-drive, memory, graphics), if you wanted Ethernet
you had to remove one of the options and give up that capability.
[1] Bob's mention that the DECnet for DOS mentions Rainbow is
interesting, will take a look. Given there was a specific product I
wonder why it is mentioned in the DOS version, unless the so-called
DECnet for Rainbow was in fact DECnet for DOS but simply delivered on
Rainbow diskettes (due to their system-specific format).
4:33 a.m.
The release notes ("RELEAS.NOT" on diskette #4) of the DECnet/DOS v1.1 on
bitsavers
http://www.bitsavers.org/bits/DEC/decnet/
has a bunch of comments about the Rainbow.
Was there a separate release for the Rainbow??
You're right that the RX50 diskettes in the Rainbow weren't PC compatible, so it
could simply be different media.
Bob
8 Nov
8 Nov
7:29 a.m.
I tracked down Dave Mitton who was the team lead on DECnet for DOS and
later VAXmate version and Pathworks after that.
Dave made the following comment:
"The Rainbow BIOS was very different than an IBM PC type BIOS, so
there was additional code to keep that straight. Also the Rainbow's
serial adapter was different (and better!) than the PCs." - so we are
looking for DEC Rainbow specific versions of DECnet.
My request is as before if anyone has a copy of DECnet for Rainbow 1.1
I would be glad to get a copy.
thanks.
10:05 a.m.
I have something seemingly as DecNet 1.0 for Rainbow.
http://rgho.st/8zMgVgs96
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf
Of Nigel Williams
Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2018 8:29 AM
To: hecnet at update.uu.se
Subject: Re: [HECnet] DECnet for DOS / Rainbow documentation?
I tracked down Dave Mitton who was the team lead on DECnet for DOS and
later VAXmate version and Pathworks after that.
Dave made the following comment:
"The Rainbow BIOS was very different than an IBM PC type BIOS, so
there was additional code to keep that straight. Also the Rainbow's
serial adapter was different (and better!) than the PCs." - so we are
looking for DEC Rainbow specific versions of DECnet.
My request is as before if anyone has a copy of DECnet for Rainbow 1.1
I would be glad to get a copy.
thanks.
6 Nov
6 Nov
3:27 p.m.
On Mon, 5 Nov 2018, at 02:21, Nigel Williams wrote:
I am scouring the Internet for DECnet documentation
(I've looked in
the usual places), does anyone have any of the DECnet for DOS or
DECnet for Rainbow documentation?
...
Also particularly interested in the version 1.1 of the
software too
(we have 1.0 but it was significantly improved/updated with 1.1).
DECNet for Dos 1.1 is in the bit savers archives:
http://bitsavers.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/bits/DEC/decnet/
There are some DECNet related files on ftp.update.uu.se/pub/rainbow/msdos/decnet but
doesn't seem to be much of anything in the way of documentation.
Douglas
2237
days inactive
2240
days old
15 comments
8 participants
participants (8)
-
bob＠jfcl.com -
dhall.hecnet＠dhcl.co.uk -
gregg.drwho8＠gmail.com -
jhj＠trnsz.com -
mcguire＠neurotica.com -
nw＠retrocomputingtasmania.com -
paulkoning＠comcast.net -
xdelta＠meta.ua