[HECnet] Another TOPS-10 DECnet problem

Oh, that old cat fight?? Meow!!? I'm walking away from it; I don't know how much email got spewed between MRC and BAH about it.? I don't think either side ever got the point that you are not comparing apples to apples. Having looked at both schedulers, I don't immediately see that either was more efficient than the other.? There clearly was cross fertilization in a number of areas. Recall that Tops-20 has processes and that a job may have a large number of processes.? The number of jobs then is not going to be a valid comparison.? For example, let's take a look at Galaxy on Tops-10, which occupies 10 job slots: Job??? Who???? Line#??? What?? Size(P) State?? Run Time ?1??? [OPR]???? DET???? NEBULA? 26+40?? HB 0 ?3??? [OPR]????? 0????? QUEUE?? 9+38??? ^C 1 ?7??? [OPR]???? DET???? QUASAR? 40+40?? SL 1 ?9??? [OPR]???? DET???? PULSAR? 5+40??? HB SW 0 10??? [OPR]???? DET???? ORION?? 109+40? SL 0 11??? [OPR]???? DET???? NML???? 15+18?? HB 3 13??? [OPR]???? DET???? CDRIVE? 30+40?? HB 0 14??? [OPR]???? DET???? FAL-10? 104+40? SL 1 They're all underneath a _single_ job on Tops-20 or built into the EXE?, but producing the same load because it is the same code. We did do some instrumenting and we found that the snazzy parsing (COMND%) was not contributing that much to load.? There was some overhead simulating UUO's, which are obviously natively executing on Tops-10.? Nearly all editing was done with WYSIWYG video editing, which surely must produce more load than TECO or SOS.? Some work was put into TEXTI% to mitigate the context switching. MRC's position was that Tops-20 was doing more, but I'm not sure how comfortable I am with that.? Having used and programmed both, I think it's more like 'doing differently'.? I would say that it was rare to find people who could easily move between the two and/or who weren't highly opinionated. It's a waste of time; you bought what did the job best for your environment.? It's kind of like apples and pineapples; they sound the same but they're just not. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On 11/11/21 5:20 PM, Robert Armstrong wrote: > > >You had a 20 that would handle 600 students in 1977/???/ > > ??I think he said something about six 20s?? I?m pretty sure there?s no > way one CPU would have handled 600 timesharing users.?? We could get > to around 120 on a single KL10E with TOPS-10 before it got unbearably > slow.? With TOPS-20 on the same hardware we could only get to 80 or > so; TOPS20 was something of a pig. > > Bob >