23 Jul
2024
23 Jul
'24
10:11 p.m.
Probably I am now the worst person in the world to ask as to what is
intuitive on Tops-20, what with being saturated with it and all.
Are you referring to the programming part or the user part?
If the latter, then what is so bad about _@finger debellis@mim_? It's
the same thing you'd use for email... I don't recall that our users
complained about finger. They did, however, find plenty of other things
to point out.
If you want complicated, unintuitive and bad to use, may I suggest
trying to create a directory on ITS or deleting a file on MVS with JCL?
------------------------------------------------------------------------
On 7/21/24 6:42 AM, Johnny Billquist wrote:
I must say - in this case TOPS-20 seems rather
complicated,
unintuitive and bad to use.
The user and hostname fields... Hmm. I'll clean that up on the RSX
side. :-)
Johnny
On 2024-07-21 04:02, Thomas DeBellis wrote:
I finally remembered the syntax to force
transport. After you
aredone with whatever the host name is, you append a ".#" suffix
followed by the name of the transport protocol. Let's suppose there
is a nickname defined in the SYSTEM:HOSTS.TXT file for MIM:: as follows:
HOST : 192.108.202.74 : MIM : PDP11 : RSX :
TCP/TELNET,TCP/FTP,TCP/SMTP,TCP/FINGER :
So we can force a finger of user DEBELLIS to use a particular
transport, as below. In the output, the DCN: device is the DECnet
active component (or client) and the TCP: device is for IP, where
client or service are specified in the GTJFN% string.
*DECNET*
FINGER>debellis(a)mim.#decnet
[Fork FINGER opening DCN:MIM-117 for reading, writing]
DEBELLIS
Default directory: US00:[DEBELLIS] CLI: DCL SID: TDB
Last seen May 21 2024 23:56:54 on RT0: from VENTI2::
Logged on 8 times.
No plan.
*INTERNET*
FINGER>debellis(a)mim.#internet
[Fork FINGER opening
TCP:.30033145112-79;PERSIST:30;CONNECTION:ACTIVE for reading, writing]
DEBELLIS
Default directory: US00:[DEBELLIS] CLI: DCL SID: TDB
Last seen May 21 2024 23:56:54 on RT0: from VENTI2::
Logged on 8 times.
No plan.
I did notice that the user and host name data appear to be written in
fixed length fields, resulting in trailing spaces that were not
trimmed. This is unlike the other lines in the output. Not that it
really matters; who is running 300 baud these days except for museums?
------------------------------------------------------------------------
On 7/20/24 7:27 PM, Thomas DeBellis wrote:
All too true, except that it isn't stupid, at least not in that
particular regard.
As per my previous email, Finger uses HSTNAM to determine network
transport, which has a default order, on my systems picking DECnet
first. I'm pretty sure there was a way to force the transport
protocol, I just don't remember what the magic syntax is.
A number of system programs use HSTNAM to implement their protocols
over multiple transports. These include the mail system, the FTP
client, finger and something else (I think).
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> On 6/17/24 9:22 PM, Johnny Billquist wrote:
>
> Ugh. That notions seems risky... How do you know you should be
> using DECnet and not IP if you say @mim?
>
> After all, @mim is a perfectly valid IP address as well.
>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>> On 2024-06-18 00:47, Thomas DeBellis wrote:
>>
>> Updating the Tops-20 Finger client was simple enough, a table
>> entry for DECnet and a small routine to build the JFN string, viz:
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