On Feb 12, 2015, at 11:37 AM, Jim Carpenter <jim at deitygraveyard.com> wrote:
On Feb 12, 2015 2:27 PM, "Cory Smelosky" <b4 at gewt.net> wrote: > > I moved the PSU, re plugged it in as is...and now I can press return. >
So serial is working completely correctly now?
Data ground path routed through a poorly-plugged-in power supply? Definitely a ground problem somewhere!
Ian
On Feb 12, 2015 2:27 PM, "Cory Smelosky" <b4 at gewt.net> wrote: > > I moved the PSU, re plugged it in as is...and now I can press return. >
So serial is working completely correctly now?
I moved the PSU, re plugged it in as is...and now I can press return.
It's telling me my memory config is bad now though.
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 12, 2015, at 14:17, Johnny Billquist <bqt at softjar.se> wrote:
On 2015-02-12 20:12, Cory Smelosky wrote:
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 12, 2015, at 14:09, Peter Lothberg <roll at Stupi.SE> wrote:
Depending on config of the system chasseie ground and signal ground
might be isolated.
The only ground connected is shield ground. ;)
That is just plain wrong.
If there is a "klinik" (another DB25 port, or if it has DB25's for
user terminals (check if there is a board connected on the able)
measure from pin 7 to pin 7 in another connector.
Pin 7 is NCL on all the serial breakouts I have.
Huh? Pin 7 on a DB25 RS-232 is signal ground. It is one of the three pints you actually need. The other two being pin 2&3. No other pin is required, but 2,3,7 are the ones *absolutely* required.
And for a null modem cable, you connect:
2-3
3-2
7-7
Johnny
On 2015-02-12 20:12, Cory Smelosky wrote:
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 12, 2015, at 14:09, Peter Lothberg <roll at Stupi.SE> wrote:
Depending on config of the system chasseie ground and signal ground
might be isolated.
The only ground connected is shield ground. ;)
That is just plain wrong.
If there is a "klinik" (another DB25 port, or if it has DB25's for
user terminals (check if there is a board connected on the able)
measure from pin 7 to pin 7 in another connector.
Pin 7 is NCL on all the serial breakouts I have.
Huh? Pin 7 on a DB25 RS-232 is signal ground. It is one of the three pints you actually need. The other two being pin 2&3. No other pin is required, but 2,3,7 are the ones *absolutely* required.
And for a null modem cable, you connect:
2-3
3-2
7-7
Johnny
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 12, 2015, at 14:09, Peter Lothberg <roll at Stupi.SE> wrote:
Should I grab the iron and change pin 1 to 7?
I suggest you find out what's wrong and fix it the way it's supposed
to be..
That'd require schematics ;)
Depending on config of the system chasseie ground and signal ground
might be isolated.
The only ground connected is shield ground. ;)
If there is a "klinik" (another DB25 port, or if it has DB25's for
user terminals (check if there is a board connected on the able)
measure from pin 7 to pin 7 in another connector.
Pin 7 is NCL on all the serial breakouts I have.
My guess is that someone has "fried" the console ground wire with
current, and you should be lucky more stuff is not dead. -:)
Possible ;)
-_P
$ show sys
OpenVMS V8.3 on node CODA 12-FEB-2015 11:08:30.67 Uptime 0 00:11:00
....
$ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT F$MESSAGE (2928)
%SYSTEM-W-FISH, my hovercraft is full of eels
$
Looks like Fred is right!
Bob
Should I grab the iron and change pin 1 to 7?
I suggest you find out what's wrong and fix it the way it's supposed
to be..
Depending on config of the system chasseie ground and signal ground
might be isolated.
If there is a "klinik" (another DB25 port, or if it has DB25's for
user terminals (check if there is a board connected on the able)
measure from pin 7 to pin 7 in another connector.
My guess is that someone has "fried" the console ground wire with
current, and you should be lucky more stuff is not dead. -:)
-_P
On 2015-02-12 19:23, Cory Smelosky wrote:
None of the pins on the connector are ground. That'd explain some things.
I just want to check here, how you asserted that? The signal ground is not the same as chassis ground, so I hope you didn't just measure against some random point on a chassis, or some random pin on a DB25...
Johnny
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 12, 2015, at 13:22, Peter Lothberg <roll at Stupi.SE> wrote:
Straight gives me gibberish, null gives me output. I'll find my straight.
FWIW, if the SC40 is wired like a "real" DEC computer, then a null modem
cable would be required between the console DB25 and a VTxxx.
If the wiring (ground) was even close to correct, either crossed or non
crossed should give NO characters. -:)
--P
Okay!
Should I grab the iron and change pin 1 to 7?
Signal ground is currently floating
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 12, 2015, at 13:59, Peter Lothberg <roll at Stupi.SE> wrote:
Cory,
When you have sorted out the console thing, do:
NSP>show cpu assIGNMENT
CPU0 has the following channels assigned:
No IU channels
RH channels:
LOGICAL ACTUAL TYPE MISCELLANEOUS
5 CHN1 EI
0 CHN0 SI MASK=0x03
1 CHN2 SI MASK=0x03
7 CHN3 CI PORT#=0x3
DTEs:
LOGICAL ACTUAL TYPE MISCELLANEOUS
0 FE PRIVILEGED
and
NSP>dir
-P
Cory,
When you have sorted out the console thing, do:
NSP>show cpu assIGNMENT
CPU0 has the following channels assigned:
No IU channels
RH channels:
LOGICAL ACTUAL TYPE MISCELLANEOUS
5 CHN1 EI
0 CHN0 SI MASK=0x03
1 CHN2 SI MASK=0x03
7 CHN3 CI PORT#=0x3
DTEs:
LOGICAL ACTUAL TYPE MISCELLANEOUS
0 FE PRIVILEGED
and
NSP>dir
-P
Twisted cable...sorry. Pin far left with cable mated, looking at the mate is ground.
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 12, 2015, at 13:23, Cory Smelosky <b4 at gewt.net> wrote:
None of the pins on the connector are ground. That'd explain some things.
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 12, 2015, at 13:22, Peter Lothberg <roll at Stupi.SE> wrote:
Straight gives me gibberish, null gives me output. I'll find my straight.
FWIW, if the SC40 is wired like a "real" DEC computer, then a null modem
cable would be required between the console DB25 and a VTxxx.
If the wiring (ground) was even close to correct, either crossed or non
crossed should give NO characters. -:)
--P
Straight gives me gibberish, null gives me output. I'll find my straight.
FWIW, if the SC40 is wired like a "real" DEC computer, then a null modem
cable would be required between the console DB25 and a VTxxx.
If the wiring (ground) was even close to correct, either crossed or non
crossed should give NO characters. -:)
None of the pins on the connector are ground. That'd explain some things.
Two options:
- A cable is loose/bad
- In it's previus life someone had a ground loop, eg, like if
you plug the SC40 in to a non-grounded plug and the terminal is
grounded.
Suggest you solve this problem, trace pin 7 back to the sparc board.
---P
None of the pins on the connector are ground. That'd explain some things.
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 12, 2015, at 13:22, Peter Lothberg <roll at Stupi.SE> wrote:
Straight gives me gibberish, null gives me output. I'll find my straight.
FWIW, if the SC40 is wired like a "real" DEC computer, then a null modem
cable would be required between the console DB25 and a VTxxx.
If the wiring (ground) was even close to correct, either crossed or non
crossed should give NO characters. -:)
--P
Straight gives me gibberish, null gives me output. I'll find my straight.
FWIW, if the SC40 is wired like a "real" DEC computer, then a null modem
cable would be required between the console DB25 and a VTxxx.
If the wiring (ground) was even close to correct, either crossed or non
crossed should give NO characters. -:)
--P
On Feb 12, 2015 12:44 PM, "Cory Smelosky" <b4 at gewt.net> wrote: > On Feb 12, 2015, at 12:42, Peter Lothberg <roll at Stupi.SE> wrote: > > >> What kind of console terminal plug is on the SC40? > > > > SC30 a DB25 hanging in twisted pair wire_wrap cables..... > > SC40 a DB25 on the panel, wired perfetly normal, a stright > > male-female cable would plug a vt100 right in. > > Straight gives me gibberish, null gives me output. I'll find my straight. >
You've got cabling issues. Using a straight cable when you actually need a "null modem" cable should result in nothing, not gibberish.
I'm betting Bob Armstrong is correct.
Jim
Straight gives me gibberish, null gives me output. I'll find my straight.
FWIW, if the SC40 is wired like a "real" DEC computer, then a null modem
cable would be required between the console DB25 and a VTxxx.
Bob
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 12, 2015, at 12:42, Peter Lothberg <roll at Stupi.SE> wrote:
What kind of console terminal plug is on the SC40?
SC30 a DB25 hanging in twisted pair wire_wrap cables.....
SC40 a DB25 on the panel, wired perfetly normal, a stright
male-female cable would plug a vt100 right in.
Straight gives me gibberish, null gives me output. I'll find my straight.
On 2015-02-12 18:29, Dave McGuire wrote:
On 02/12/2015 12:23 PM, Johnny Billquist wrote:
Console TRANSMIT is fine...but RECEIVE is receiving gibberish from my
end...can't figure out why. ? works, every other symbol is either | } or
w or y.
Makes it a liiiiiittle hard to boot.
Sigh... I suspect the standard problems. Check your character length,
parity, stop bits...
Have people totally forgotten how to use a serial line???
Please give Cory a bit more credit than that, man. Seriously. This
guy has gotten some truly outlandish systems up and running in no time
with almost no assistance. He wrangles serial lines with the best of 'em.
Sorry. It's just that sometimes my patience runs thin. And the video just shows someone who is trying totally random things without giving me any impression he knows at all what he is doing.
I'm probably just expecting things at a level you don't see anymore.
Johnny
On 2015-02-12 18:17, Cory Smelosky wrote:
Check later on, I tried every one my 420 offers...not all shown in video
though
Jeez. Ok, looked through the whole video.
You need to calm down and stop being all over the place.
First of all, since some characters work, while others do not, it's extremely likely that it's a problem with your serial comm setup.
Stop hitting all kind of random keys that you do not know what they do, it do not help. For your information, the arrow keys, as well as the "DO" key, and others, all send several characters over the serial line. Do not use them for now. Not only will it just confuse you, if the system don't actually understand such sequences as these keys send, you might get very strange and unwanted effects on the SC40.
Second, try to understand what you actually do when you change different things in the VT420.
Latin-1 vs. DEC MCS for instance, is totally irrelevant here.
Serial communication is not really that hard, but the way you just change things around suggest that you don't understand it.
Start with just 7 bits no parity. Try both one and two stop bits. Then move on from there.
Bob also suggested that you might have mixed up GND and TX, which actually is a good suggestion.
CR is 015(8), while } is 175(8). In fact, all those } suggests that 1 and 0 could be mixed up, in which case you also fail on the start bit, in addition to getting all those ones...
I would probably try just looping back TX to RX at the SC40 end of the cable to verify that the cable is correct. That would reveal if you did this mistake...
Johnny
Johnny
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 12, 2015, at 12:15, Jim Carpenter <jim at deitygraveyard.com
<mailto:jim at deitygraveyard.com>> wrote:
On Feb 12, 2015 12:11 PM, "Cory Smelosky" <b4 at gewt.net
<mailto:b4 at gewt.net>> wrote:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LAPAwzoeiQ
>
> Here's a video of what it does.
>
>
Typing some letters works but others don't? Check your parity.
Jim
What kind of console terminal plug is on the SC40?
SC30 a DB25 hanging in twisted pair wire_wrap cables.....
SC40 a DB25 on the panel, wired perfetly normal, a stright
male-female cable would plug a vt100 right in.
Looks like 8.3 is required! ?
I was going to fire up my DS20E and try it for myself, but it appears all
my VMS licenses have expired since I last used it. Don't you just hate it
when that happens ??
Bob
On Thu, 12 Feb 2015, Mark Pizzolato - Info Comm wrote:
How did this diversion get injected into this discussion?
Fred, is this merely part of one of your signatures?
Yes. I rotate .signature s occasionally and this one is currently in the rotation. Kind-of like my BBS days with a .QWK mailer that would rotate signatures, although I do it now manually.
I'm tempted to change the subject line but really don't want this to keeping burrowing down the off-topic rabbit hole. :)
Fred
---
$ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT F$MESSAGE (2928)
%SYSTEM-W-FISH, my hovercraft is full of eels
I've tried all the permutations!
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 12, 2015, at 12:23, Johnny Billquist <bqt at softjar.se> wrote:
On 2015-02-12 17:27, Cory Smelosky wrote:
On Thu, 12 Feb 2015, Peter Lothberg wrote:
Need a little help with the boot process. THis is the output...it hangs
afterwards.
It looks like you are echoing the characters from the console back to
itself, "half duplex"?
Alright. It loaded microcode now! 16MWord!
However...
Console TRANSMIT is fine...but RECEIVE is receiving gibberish from my
end...can't figure out why. ? works, every other symbol is either | } or
w or y.
Makes it a liiiiiittle hard to boot.
Sigh... I suspect the standard problems. Check your character length, parity, stop bits...
Have people totally forgotten how to use a serial line???
Johnny
DB25 null from mono price.
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 12, 2015, at 12:23, Robert Armstrong <bob at jfcl.com> wrote:
> I tried every one my 420 offers...not all shown in video though
What kind of console terminal plug is on the SC40? Are you sure your cable is wired correctly? I ve seen this kind of funny business happen when the ground was swapped with the data pins that s not uncommon with homemade MMJ cables.
Bob
itself, "half duplex"?
Alright. It loaded microcode now! 16MWord!
However...
Console TRANSMIT is fine...but RECEIVE is receiving gibberish from my
end...can't figure out why. ? works, every other symbol is either | } or
w or y.
8 bits (highest bit sent as 0), no parity, one stop
Check your RS232 levels on the line to the SC40.
Makes it a liiiiiittle hard to boot.
Actually, if you have drive that was used to actually run the
machine, it will boot by itself and bring up the OS.
Unplug the terminal so you don't confuce it, hit the reset switch
on the front and wait 5 minutes.
-P
