On Wed, 2 Oct 2013, Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman- wrote:
Cory Smelosky <b4 at gewt.net> writes:
On Wed, 2 Oct 2013, Kari Uusim=E4ki wrote:=0D
=0D
On 2.10.2013 23:11, Cory Smelosky wrote:=0D
Hello,=0D
=0D
I finally managed yo get a console working on this...so I want to get it=
=0D
on to HECnet again=0D
=0D
However when booting from CD-ROM: %SYSBOOT-E-System version mismatch=0D
found EXEC_INIT.EXE=0D
=0D
What am I forgetting to do?=0D
=0D
=0D
It would be much easier to diagnose if you would describe how you are doi=
ng =0D
the boot, with which parameters and in which phase you get the error mess=
age.=0D
Even better to post the whole booting session output from your console.=
=0D
=0D
=0D
Simply: boot dka300 (DKA300 is the CD-ROM)=0D
=0D
It does this shortly after loading the boot images. 7.2 gets =0D
further...but it BUGCHKs before entering BACKUP.=0D
Are these OPenVMS installation disks you burned yourself? Are you trying
to read these with an RD45 or earlier?
I burned them myself, yes. The drive shows up as "RDDISK"...it's not an official RRD40/RRD45.
--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Projects
=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Kari_Uusim=E4ki?= <uusimaki at exdecfinland.org> writes:
On 2.10.2013 23:27, Cory Smelosky wrote:
On Wed, 2 Oct 2013, Kari Uusim=E4ki wrote:
On 2.10.2013 23:11, Cory Smelosky wrote:
Hello,
I finally managed yo get a console working on this...so I want to get=
it
on to HECnet again
However when booting from CD-ROM: %SYSBOOT-E-System version mismatch
found EXEC_INIT.EXE
What am I forgetting to do?
It would be much easier to diagnose if you would describe how you are
doing
the boot, with which parameters and in which phase you get the error
message.
Even better to post the whole booting session output from your console=
.
Simply: boot dka300 (DKA300 is the CD-ROM)
Depends...
Issue a "SHOW DEVICE" at the dead sargent and post the output.
--
VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG
Well I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.
On 2.10.2013 23:27, Cory Smelosky wrote:
On Wed, 2 Oct 2013, Kari Uusim ki wrote:
On 2.10.2013 23:11, Cory Smelosky wrote:
Hello,
I finally managed yo get a console working on this...so I want to get it
on to HECnet again
However when booting from CD-ROM: %SYSBOOT-E-System version mismatch
found EXEC_INIT.EXE
What am I forgetting to do?
It would be much easier to diagnose if you would describe how you are
doing
the boot, with which parameters and in which phase you get the error
message.
Even better to post the whole booting session output from your console.
Simply: boot dka300 (DKA300 is the CD-ROM)
It does this shortly after loading the boot images. 7.2 gets
further...but it BUGCHKs before entering BACKUP.
Are you sure you have the SCSI bus intact and terminated accordingly?
And your installation media (CD-ROM) is known to be working?
Kari
Cory Smelosky <b4 at gewt.net> writes:
On Wed, 2 Oct 2013, Kari Uusim=E4ki wrote:=0D
=0D
On 2.10.2013 23:11, Cory Smelosky wrote:=0D
Hello,=0D
=0D
I finally managed yo get a console working on this...so I want to get it=
=0D
on to HECnet again=0D
=0D
However when booting from CD-ROM: %SYSBOOT-E-System version mismatch=0D
found EXEC_INIT.EXE=0D
=0D
What am I forgetting to do?=0D
=0D
=0D
It would be much easier to diagnose if you would describe how you are doi=
ng =0D
the boot, with which parameters and in which phase you get the error mess=
age.=0D
Even better to post the whole booting session output from your console.=
=0D
=0D
=0D
Simply: boot dka300 (DKA300 is the CD-ROM)=0D
=0D
It does this shortly after loading the boot images. 7.2 gets =0D
further...but it BUGCHKs before entering BACKUP.=0D
Are these OPenVMS installation disks you burned yourself? Are you trying
to read these with an RD45 or earlier?
--
VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG
Well I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.
On Wed, 2 Oct 2013, Kari Uusim ki wrote:
On 2.10.2013 23:11, Cory Smelosky wrote:
Hello,
I finally managed yo get a console working on this...so I want to get it
on to HECnet again
However when booting from CD-ROM: %SYSBOOT-E-System version mismatch
found EXEC_INIT.EXE
What am I forgetting to do?
It would be much easier to diagnose if you would describe how you are doing the boot, with which parameters and in which phase you get the error message.
Even better to post the whole booting session output from your console.
Simply: boot dka300 (DKA300 is the CD-ROM)
It does this shortly after loading the boot images. 7.2 gets further...but it BUGCHKs before entering BACKUP.
Kari
--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Projects
On 2.10.2013 23:11, Cory Smelosky wrote:
Hello,
I finally managed yo get a console working on this...so I want to get it
on to HECnet again
However when booting from CD-ROM: %SYSBOOT-E-System version mismatch
found EXEC_INIT.EXE
What am I forgetting to do?
It would be much easier to diagnose if you would describe how you are doing the boot, with which parameters and in which phase you get the error message.
Even better to post the whole booting session output from your console.
Kari
Hello,
I finally managed yo get a console working on this...so I want to get it on to HECnet again
However when booting from CD-ROM: %SYSBOOT-E-System version mismatch found EXEC_INIT.EXE
What am I forgetting to do?
--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Projects
Sampsa Laine <sampsa at mac.com> writes:
=20
Not at all. One can even run X11 over LAT!
=20
So when they talk about LAT support they're not going to fall back into =
some kind of VT220 emulator but try to actually connect to an X11 server =
over LAT? How do you tell DECwindows to even answer those requests?
I'm not quite following your question. LAT is just a transport just like
TCP/IP and DECnet. Why do you thing there should be any issue with an X11
client and the X11 server? It's transparent to them.
--
VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG
Well I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.
Fantastic. I remember reading that a long long time ago, just when we were phasing the VMS machines and terminals out in favour of Ultrix DECstations and VAXstations.
On Wed, Oct 2, 2013 at 7:24 PM, Sampsa Laine <sampsa at mac.com> wrote:
This book is hilarious, and can be copied from CHIMPY::UGH.PDF over HECnet.
sampsa
Not at all. One can even run X11 over LAT!
So when they talk about LAT support they're not going to fall back into some kind of VT220 emulator but try to actually connect to an X11 server over LAT? How do you tell DECwindows to even answer those requests?
sampsa
Brian, how do you think this is going? Are we going to get them to hook =
up?
I do believe so. There are some other things concerning Eisner that need
to be addressed before connection to HECnet (not involving the connection)
but I'm not at liberty to discuss them publicly. It's nothing ominous, so
just sit tight.
Good to hear that! Something I've been considering for a while is that if they were to join, should we invite their whole userbase to the HECnet mailing list or possibly just the EISNER adminds?
I personally think the admins would make a better choice, there are lists like DECTEK for general DEChead stuff.
Cory Smelosky <b4 at gewt.net> writes:
yOn Wed, 2 Oct 2013, Dave McGuire wrote:
On 10/02/2013 03:04 PM, Sampsa Laine wrote:
Reading a manual for a NCD X terminal and it interestingly supports X11 over DECNET.
Anybody have much experience with this?
I ran it very briefly between a MicroVAX-II and a VAXstation-2000 a
long time ago, just to play with it. It was neat when I got it working,
but then it dawned on me that it really wasn't any different from
running it over TCP/IP. ;)
Meaning it works for a few minutes and then breaks completely? ;)
Not at all. One can even run X11 over LAT!
--
VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG
Well I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.
Dave McGuire <mcguire at neurotica.com> writes:
On 10/02/2013 03:04 PM, Sampsa Laine wrote:
Reading a manual for a NCD X terminal and it interestingly supports X11 over DECNET.
Anybody have much experience with this?
I ran it very briefly between a MicroVAX-II and a VAXstation-2000 a
long time ago, just to play with it. It was neat when I got it working,
but then it dawned on me that it really wasn't any different from
running it over TCP/IP. ;)
Save that there's more information in the DECnet for authentication.
--
VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG
Well I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.
Sampsa Laine <sampsa at mac.com> writes:
Reading a manual for a NCD X terminal and it interestingly supports X11 =
over DECNET.
Anybody have much experience with this?
Lots. Over DECnet, the node and username are part of the X11 authentication.
--
VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG
Well I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.
Sampsa Laine <sampsa at mac.com> writes:
Been reading the NOTES thread, there seems to be one person vaguely wary =
due to security reasons (valid, but overly paranoid IMHO) and the other =
posts seem relatively positive.
Brian, how do you think this is going? Are we going to get them to hook =
up?
I do believe so. There are some other things concerning Eisner that need
to be addressed before connection to HECnet (not involving the connection)
but I'm not at liberty to discuss them publicly. It's nothing ominous, so
just sit tight.
--
VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG
Well I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.
How about SOS? Perhaps EDT's line mode is close enough
(or my ZX81 port), but it would be nice to have an Emacs emulation
mode where the cursor neatly always stays in the minibuffer...
On Wed, Oct 02, 2013 at 09:18:39PM +0200, Sampsa Laine wrote:
On 2 Oct 2013, at 21:11, Dave McGuire <mcguire at neurotica.com> wrote:
On 10/02/2013 03:10 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote:
Emacs has too high of a learning curve for me...with vi I prefer vim.
Emacs has an OBSCENE learning curve. But if you give it the time that
it takes, it will reward you for the rest of your life.
I full agree with that sentiment, I can use Emacs to a basic degree (I don't progam in elisp or anything) and it is a very effective editor.
Shame it doesn't come as standard on all *nix boxes, I have to revert to vi (UNIX) or nano/pico (most Linux distros)
On Wed, 2 Oct 2013, Sampsa Laine wrote:
This book is hilarious, and can be copied from CHIMPY::UGH.PDF over HECnet.
I just bought a paperback copy today. Along with a hardback copy of The Cuckoo's Egg. (Said hardback copy was like $4 shipped)
sampsa
--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Projects
On Wed, 2 Oct 2013, Sampsa Laine wrote:
On 2 Oct 2013, at 21:11, Dave McGuire <mcguire at neurotica.com> wrote:
On 10/02/2013 03:10 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote:
Emacs has too high of a learning curve for me...with vi I prefer vim.
Emacs has an OBSCENE learning curve. But if you give it the time that
it takes, it will reward you for the rest of your life.
I full agree with that sentiment, I can use Emacs to a basic degree (I don't progam in elisp or anything) and it is a very effective editor.
Shame it doesn't come as standard on all *nix boxes, I have to revert to vi (UNIX) or nano/pico (most Linux distros)
My love of pico could be related to my love of Alpine, too.
--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Projects
On Wed, 2 Oct 2013, Dave McGuire wrote:
On 10/02/2013 03:16 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote:
I ran it very briefly between a MicroVAX-II and a VAXstation-2000 a
long time ago, just to play with it. It was neat when I got it
working,
but then it dawned on me that it really wasn't any different from
running it over TCP/IP. ;)
Meaning it works for a few minutes and then breaks completely? ;)
Not at all. I've run X since X10R4 (yes, X *TEN* release four), and
have never seen it actually break. What are you up to? ;)
Trying to use it on a PeeCee. ;)
Oh good heavens. Life's too short, man.
I need to GET workstations first! ;)
If I used a real workstation that worked I'd have an excuse to be
productive.
Productivity is a good thing.
Now that I've run out of stuff to do, agreed.
-Dave
--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Projects
On 2 Oct 2013, at 21:11, Dave McGuire <mcguire at neurotica.com> wrote:
On 10/02/2013 03:10 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote:
Emacs has too high of a learning curve for me...with vi I prefer vim.
Emacs has an OBSCENE learning curve. But if you give it the time that
it takes, it will reward you for the rest of your life.
I full agree with that sentiment, I can use Emacs to a basic degree (I don't progam in elisp or anything) and it is a very effective editor.
Shame it doesn't come as standard on all *nix boxes, I have to revert to vi (UNIX) or nano/pico (most Linux distros)
On 10/02/2013 03:16 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote:
I ran it very briefly between a MicroVAX-II and a VAXstation-2000 a
long time ago, just to play with it. It was neat when I got it
working,
but then it dawned on me that it really wasn't any different from
running it over TCP/IP. ;)
Meaning it works for a few minutes and then breaks completely? ;)
Not at all. I've run X since X10R4 (yes, X *TEN* release four), and
have never seen it actually break. What are you up to? ;)
Trying to use it on a PeeCee. ;)
Oh good heavens. Life's too short, man.
If I used a real workstation that worked I'd have an excuse to be
productive.
Productivity is a good thing.
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
On Wed, 2 Oct 2013, Dave McGuire wrote:
On 10/02/2013 03:11 PM, Cory Smelosky wrote:
I ran it very briefly between a MicroVAX-II and a VAXstation-2000 a
long time ago, just to play with it. It was neat when I got it working,
but then it dawned on me that it really wasn't any different from
running it over TCP/IP. ;)
Meaning it works for a few minutes and then breaks completely? ;)
Not at all. I've run X since X10R4 (yes, X *TEN* release four), and
have never seen it actually break. What are you up to? ;)
Trying to use it on a PeeCee. ;)
If I used a real workstation that worked I'd have an excuse to be productive.
-Dave
--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Projects
On Wed, 2 Oct 2013, Dave McGuire wrote:
On 10/02/2013 03:03 PM, Clem Cole wrote:
EDT is pure heaven.
Dave this comment made me laugh.
I'm an emacs guy; I live in emacs most every day. I remember the
first time I tried the EDT emulation mode. It seemed so very right and
yet so very wrong, at the same time. :-)
Ahhh Emacs! A very extensible OS that has a good text editor now. ;) Shame it has to run second-level under another OS most of the time. ;)
In the end its all about choice and what makes you comfortable.
Of course. As long as it's emacs! B-)
I'm
jaded enough to realize that all the editors from those times are
similar and all can do cool things when they ran on "glass ttys" - it's
just what you learned and have burned into the ROMs in your fingers AND
how well the editor is integrated into the native system. I learned
IBM/TSS on a ASR 33 with a line editor, I bet it you tossed that too me
now I would scream. If I had a 10 again, I wonder what I would use,
as I know at this stage, I've forgotten teco. For VMS I think these
days I would just use vi and be done with it. There is something to be
said for an editor that just works.
That said, the folks that wrote vim changed it just slightly from vi
[they "fixed it" of course] and when I try editing on a my Mac or a
Linux box it sometimes drives me nuts as I can not reprogram those
fingers at my age.
I'm right there with you. Emacs since v18. Good stuff. But my
fingers still remember and adore EDT whenever I'm on a PDP-11 or a VAX.
Or a PDP-10 once you get a MASSBUS drive and let me at your -10s
-Dave
--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Projects
EDT (DEC VMS editor)
Turn on EDT emulation with M-x edt-emulation-on; restore normal command bindings with M-x edt-emulation-off.
But what was interesting to me to watch over time the ex-VMS folks take one of three directions even with the having "Emacs-EDT" available:
1.) switch to a native emacs 'cause they found it more powerful than EDT (i.e. learn now emacs could be "bound" to UNIX and discovered they liked it).
2.) switch to vi because it ran on everything (from a PC to Cray and in between inc VAX/VMS) which in those days emacs did not [this is what I did and never looked back]
3.) a one guy refused it all and spent a couple of weeks writing a teco clone (which you can still download from his web site). I used to think that was pretty close to the original for those us that learned teco on the PDP-10's years ago - but by that time, I was fully vi literate so why both going back.
Just tried that in Aquamacs (COCOA port of Emacs) and the feature is still included.
wooo, OS X EDT!
http://sampsa.com/emacsedt.png
