At 11:26 AM +0200 8/20/09, Johnny Billquist wrote:
Christine Caulfield wrote:
Then again ... I've not had any bug reports from anyone about either and it's quite hard to fix bugs you don't know about :-P
Sorry, you're right. I think I've only talked with you on perhaps rather
vague terms about the problems I've had.
Ditto, though last I tried Linux DECnet was in the late 90's. It's also worth mentioning that DECnet/E seems to have trouble coexisting with just about anything, so DECnet/Linux isn't alone. :-)
Zane
--
| Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator |
| healyzh at aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast |
| MONK::HEALYZH (DECnet) | Classic Computer Collector |
+----------------------------------+----------------------------+
| Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, |
| PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. |
| http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ |
Christine Caulfield wrote:
On 20/08/09 09:41, Johnny Billquist wrote:
Gregg Levine wrote:
Hello!
Steve I have three here, all DEC Server 90s. They aren't exactly
friendly to the Linux-DECNet code. Whereas the 200s are more to their
liking (The code base that is.)
However there's something about the basic 200 that resembles the PDP
background for them......
There are plenty of problems with the Linux LAT code (this isn't
DECnet). I tried looking at it a few years ago, but decided that it
would be easier to rewrite all of it instead of trying to fix that code.
But then I got sidetracked (as often happens), so I haven't done
anything about it.
Several people have already come to that conclusion, including me! It was written while I was reverse-engineering it so it's built up as a heap of guesses on top of other guesses. It works most of the time, to VMS, but as I didn't (and still don't) have anything else to test against that's where it stayed. I don't even have many DECservers to test against any more, my 90s power supply died (twice) and the 200 melted after the fans broke down :-( So the code languishes in its current state.
I also happen to think that C++ is a bad language choice. :-)
But it don't seem that many people are inclined to fix this. We'll see
what happens in the future. The LAT specs are atleast available
nowadays, so it should be easier to do this "right" now.
That said, I have also had problems with the Linux DECnet code.
Christine might remember me complaining in the past. :-)
It works fine with VMS, but horribly with RSX (which also is true of the
LAT code).
Although I've not tried doing much with Linux DECnet to RSX it's always seemed to work for me when I have tried it. I suspect that any problems here are much easier to fix. Even though the main protocol is in the kernel (unlike LAT) it's pretty solid code, so anything that needs fixing will most likely be in userspace. Most (though not all!) of that was written from proper specifications so should be easier to work with than LAT.
I think it's all userspace programs that I have had problems with.
Then again ... I've not had any bug reports from anyone about either and it's quite hard to fix bugs you don't know about :-P
Sorry, you're right. I think I've only talked with you on perhaps rather
vague terms about the problems I've had.
But as we now have HECnet, this is way easier to work on.
I suggest you log into MIM, and then just try to do a few different things:
1) Try phone to a Linux box. Initiated from both sides.
2) Try accessing files from both sides to the other side.
Neither of these things worked when I last tried.
And that's a start atleast. :-)
Johnny
--
Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
|| on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt at softjar.se || Reading murder books
pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
On 20/08/09 09:41, Johnny Billquist wrote:
Gregg Levine wrote:
On Wed, Aug 19, 2009 at 1:01 PM, Steve Davidson<jeep at scshome.net> wrote:
What you really want to try for is a DECserver 90TL. This will do Telnet
and LAT in both directions. Let's not forget smaller/lighter and
easier on
the electric bill. Don't forget the power supply, or the mini-rack
(includes power supply), or the DEChub-90 backplane to power this.
-Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE on behalf of Sampsa Laine
Sent: Wed 8/19/2009 12:52
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Downtime next week
On 19 Aug 2009, at 07:20, Gregg Levine wrote:
Hello!
I am both relieved in thinking that I am not the only one on this list
to be considered like that, and jealous especially considering the
DECserver 200.
I've been trying to track down one of those beasts for a very long
while now. Practically the entire time period that I've known (in a
matter of speaking) all of you on this list, plus the few I know from
two other lists. (Three even.)
I got mine off ebay, a quick look on US ebay shows that there are
plenty of them available, e.g.:
DECserver 700-16:
http://cgi.ebay.com/DEC-Digital-DECserver-700-DSRVW-ZC-700-16_W0QQitemZ2903…
DECserver 200/MC:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Digital-DECserver-200-MC-DSRVB-A_W0QQitemZ130324846349Q…
Sampsa
Hello!
Steve I have three here, all DEC Server 90s. They aren't exactly
friendly to the Linux-DECNet code. Whereas the 200s are more to their
liking (The code base that is.)
However there's something about the basic 200 that resembles the PDP
background for them......
There are plenty of problems with the Linux LAT code (this isn't
DECnet). I tried looking at it a few years ago, but decided that it
would be easier to rewrite all of it instead of trying to fix that code.
But then I got sidetracked (as often happens), so I haven't done
anything about it.
Several people have already come to that conclusion, including me! It was written while I was reverse-engineering it so it's built up as a heap of guesses on top of other guesses. It works most of the time, to VMS, but as I didn't (and still don't) have anything else to test against that's where it stayed. I don't even have many DECservers to test against any more, my 90s power supply died (twice) and the 200 melted after the fans broke down :-( So the code languishes in its current state.
That said, I have also had problems with the Linux DECnet code.
Christine might remember me complaining in the past. :-)
It works fine with VMS, but horribly with RSX (which also is true of the
LAT code).
Although I've not tried doing much with Linux DECnet to RSX it's always seemed to work for me when I have tried it. I suspect that any problems here are much easier to fix. Even though the main protocol is in the kernel (unlike LAT) it's pretty solid code, so anything that needs fixing will most likely be in userspace. Most (though not all!) of that was written from proper specifications so should be easier to work with than LAT.
Then again ... I've not had any bug reports from anyone about either and it's quite hard to fix bugs you don't know about :-P
Chrissie
Gregg Levine wrote:
On Wed, Aug 19, 2009 at 1:01 PM, Steve Davidson<jeep at scshome.net> wrote:
What you really want to try for is a DECserver 90TL. This will do Telnet
and LAT in both directions. Let's not forget smaller/lighter and easier on
the electric bill. Don't forget the power supply, or the mini-rack
(includes power supply), or the DEChub-90 backplane to power this.
-Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE on behalf of Sampsa Laine
Sent: Wed 8/19/2009 12:52
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Downtime next week
On 19 Aug 2009, at 07:20, Gregg Levine wrote:
Hello!
I am both relieved in thinking that I am not the only one on this list
to be considered like that, and jealous especially considering the
DECserver 200.
I've been trying to track down one of those beasts for a very long
while now. Practically the entire time period that I've known (in a
matter of speaking) all of you on this list, plus the few I know from
two other lists. (Three even.)
I got mine off ebay, a quick look on US ebay shows that there are
plenty of them available, e.g.:
DECserver 700-16:
http://cgi.ebay.com/DEC-Digital-DECserver-700-DSRVW-ZC-700-16_W0QQitemZ2903…
DECserver 200/MC:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Digital-DECserver-200-MC-DSRVB-A_W0QQitemZ130324846349Q…
Sampsa
Hello!
Steve I have three here, all DEC Server 90s. They aren't exactly
friendly to the Linux-DECNet code. Whereas the 200s are more to their
liking (The code base that is.)
However there's something about the basic 200 that resembles the PDP
background for them......
There are plenty of problems with the Linux LAT code (this isn't
DECnet). I tried looking at it a few years ago, but decided that it
would be easier to rewrite all of it instead of trying to fix that code.
But then I got sidetracked (as often happens), so I haven't done
anything about it.
That said, I have also had problems with the Linux DECnet code.
Christine might remember me complaining in the past. :-)
It works fine with VMS, but horribly with RSX (which also is true of the
LAT code).
Johnny
--
Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
|| on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt at softjar.se || Reading murder books
pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
Sridhar Ayengar wrote:
Sampsa Laine wrote:
On 19 Aug 2009, at 07:20, Gregg Levine wrote:
Hello!
I am both relieved in thinking that I am not the only one on this list
to be considered like that, and jealous especially considering the
DECserver 200.
I've been trying to track down one of those beasts for a very long
while now. Practically the entire time period that I've known (in a
matter of speaking) all of you on this list, plus the few I know from
two other lists. (Three even.)
I got mine off ebay, a quick look on US ebay shows that there are plenty of them available, e.g.:
DECserver 700-16:
http://cgi.ebay.com/DEC-Digital-DECserver-700-DSRVW-ZC-700-16_W0QQitemZ2903… <http://cgi.ebay.com/DEC-Digital-DECserver-700-DSRVW-ZC-700-16_W0QQitemZ2903…>
DECserver 200/MC:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Digital-DECserver-200-MC-DSRVB-A_W0QQitemZ130324846349Q… <http://cgi.ebay.com/Digital-DECserver-200-MC-DSRVB-A_W0QQitemZ130324846349Q…>
The one you really want is the DECserver 932. It's dense.
Peace... Sridhar
I've got a DECserver 900TM which works pretty well but I've noticed a pretty significant lag/poor performance when I use the TCP/IP connection. It's the only one I've ever had so I don't know if it's typical for these units or if I have a problem.
John H. Reinhardt
On Wed, Aug 19, 2009 at 1:01 PM, Steve Davidson<jeep at scshome.net> wrote:
What you really want to try for is a DECserver 90TL. This will do Telnet
and LAT in both directions. Let's not forget smaller/lighter and easier on
the electric bill. Don't forget the power supply, or the mini-rack
(includes power supply), or the DEChub-90 backplane to power this.
-Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE on behalf of Sampsa Laine
Sent: Wed 8/19/2009 12:52
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Downtime next week
On 19 Aug 2009, at 07:20, Gregg Levine wrote:
Hello!
I am both relieved in thinking that I am not the only one on this list
to be considered like that, and jealous especially considering the
DECserver 200.
I've been trying to track down one of those beasts for a very long
while now. Practically the entire time period that I've known (in a
matter of speaking) all of you on this list, plus the few I know from
two other lists. (Three even.)
I got mine off ebay, a quick look on US ebay shows that there are
plenty of them available, e.g.:
DECserver 700-16:
http://cgi.ebay.com/DEC-Digital-DECserver-700-DSRVW-ZC-700-16_W0QQitemZ2903…
DECserver 200/MC:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Digital-DECserver-200-MC-DSRVB-A_W0QQitemZ130324846349Q…
Sampsa
Hello!
Steve I have three here, all DEC Server 90s. They aren't exactly
friendly to the Linux-DECNet code. Whereas the 200s are more to their
liking (The code base that is.)
However there's something about the basic 200 that resembles the PDP
background for them......
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8 at gmail.com
"This signature was once found posting rude
messages in English in the Moscow subway."
What you really want to try for is a DECserver 90TL. This will do Telnet and LAT in both directions. Let's not forget smaller/lighter and easier on the electric bill. Don't forget the power supply, or the mini-rack (includes power supply), or the DEChub-90 backplane to power this. -Steve -----Original Message----- From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE on behalf of Sampsa Laine Sent: Wed 8/19/2009 12:52 To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE Subject: Re: [HECnet] Downtime next week On 19 Aug 2009, at 07:20, Gregg Levine wrote: > > Hello! > I am both relieved in thinking that I am not the only one on this list > to be considered like that, and jealous especially considering the > DECserver 200. > > I've been trying to track down one of those beasts for a very long > while now. Practically the entire time period that I've known (in a > matter of speaking) all of you on this list, plus the few I know from > two other lists. (Three even.) I got mine off ebay, a quick look on US ebay shows that there are plenty of them available, e.g.: DECserver 700-16: http://cgi.ebay.com/DEC-Digital-DECserver-700-DSRVW-ZC-700-16_W0QQitemZ2903… DECserver 200/MC: http://cgi.ebay.com/Digital-DECserver-200-MC-DSRVB-A_W0QQitemZ130324846349Q… Sampsa
On 19 Aug 2009, at 07:20, Gregg Levine wrote:
Hello!
I am both relieved in thinking that I am not the only one on this list
to be considered like that, and jealous especially considering the
DECserver 200.
I've been trying to track down one of those beasts for a very long
while now. Practically the entire time period that I've known (in a
matter of speaking) all of you on this list, plus the few I know from
two other lists. (Three even.)
I got mine off ebay, a quick look on US ebay shows that there are plenty of them available, e.g.:
DECserver 700-16:
http://cgi.ebay.com/DEC-Digital-DECserver-700-DSRVW-ZC-700-16_W0QQitemZ2903…
DECserver 200/MC:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Digital-DECserver-200-MC-DSRVB-A_W0QQitemZ130324846349Q…
Sampsa
On Tue, Aug 18, 2009 at 9:04 PM, Sampsa Laine<sampsa at mac.com> wrote:
Guys,
I will most likely be experiencing some downtime next week due to an
upcoming house move, probably Thursday - Saturday.
This will mean that:
- GORVAX will be down, so anyone routing MULTINET through it will be
down as well
- CHIMPY will be down
- The IP addresses used for GORVAX's MULTINET and my bridge to Johnny
MIGHT change - the ISP has not confirmed or denied this.
However, on the plus side, the new apartment will have dual 20 down/2.5 up
DSL links with a load balancing router.
In addition to this, I have had a 47U rack* installed into a spare room so I
will be able to bring some additional hardware online, including:
- CHIMP. AlphaServer 4100, 2 CPUs with 2 GB of RAM and about 120 GBs
of disk
- RHESUS. Itanium rx2600 with dual 900 MHz CPUs and 8 GBs of RAM,
300 GB or so of disk.
- MKYVAX. VAXstation 90A, not sure about the config got it off ebay
and haven't had time to fire it up
- A DECserver 200 with various toys attached including some Amigas
and old CBM machines.
Accounts will be available on all of the above to anyone interested.
Sampsa
* I had this installed (along with 30+ cat6 points around the flat) in to a
flat in Zone 2 of Central London. My builders think I am insane and/or a mad
scientist of some kind.
Hello!
I am both relieved in thinking that I am not the only one on this list
to be considered like that, and jealous especially considering the
DECserver 200.
I've been trying to track down one of those beasts for a very long
while now. Practically the entire time period that I've known (in a
matter of speaking) all of you on this list, plus the few I know from
two other lists. (Three even.)
I hope your move goes well, and that there isn't any problem with
setting up everything all over again. And that nothing throws a simian
spanner into things as well.
And as for that terminal server, should you manage to find another
one, please see how much it weighs and how much it would cost to send
it to this side of the pond. (If I can find the room for it....)
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8 at gmail.com
"This signature was once found posting rude
messages in English in the Moscow Metro."
