On 04/11/2012 09:23 AM, Steve Davidson wrote:
On the other hand... Adding a soft link (and documenting it - don't ALL
system managers document their system changes???) may be preferred to
changing the makefile because once you change the makefile you OWN its
maintenance. Different strokes for different folks.
In my case, I OWNED its maintenance for the five minutes it remained
in existence, before I deleted the source tree after running "make
install". Fixing where poorly-written Makefiles look for libraries is
UNIX Administration 101.
And why symlinking stuff into non-distribution-standard locations to
compensate for one poorly-written Makefile is a bad idea is 102. ;)
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
Somehow I get the feeling he was pulling your leg ever so gently Sidhar ;-)
-----Original Message-----
From: Sridhar Ayengar <ploopster at gmail.com>
Sender: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2012 11:20:19
To: <hecnet at Update.UU.SE>
Reply-To: hecnet at Update.UU.SECc: Brian Hechinger<wonko at 4amlunch.net>
Subject: Re: [HECnet] building simh
Brian Hechinger wrote:
Ignore him. Adding cruft to your filesystem when you could simply fix
the makefile is a silly suggestion.
Maintaining a site-specific patch to the Makefile temporarily until the
project Makefile is changed is more work than just leaving the symlink
in place until the project Makefile is changed.
Peace... Sridhar
Hi Sridhar!! :-P
-brian
On 4/11/2012 9:13 AM, hvlems at zonnet.nl wrote:
Sridhar, you are a jolly fellow aren't you ?
Now I thought I understood the way linux uses libraries and yet you
add another mystery Is it because you want to keep me in a perpetual
mystified state of mind?
Hans
:-)
-----Original Message-----
From: Sridhar Ayengar<ploopster at gmail.com>
Sender: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2012 08:52:15
To:<hecnet at Update.UU.SE>
Reply-To: hecnet at Update.UU.SECc: Dave McGuire<mcguire at neurotica.com>
Subject: Re: [HECnet] building simh
Dave McGuire wrote:
Is it possible to explain what the magic does?
More precisely: what is the difference between an .a and an .so
library?
I detailed this a few posts ago. .a is a static library, .so is a
shared library.
How on earth does -lpcap point to /usr/lib?
-lpcap tells the linker to look in every directory in the library
search path to find either libpcap.a or libpcap.so.
This library lives in /usr/lib on most systems, but the simh makefile
hard-coding that path (and hard-coding it to only find the static
library) is a big mistake.
It is, but why not just symlink it for the time being?
Peace... Sridhar
Brian Hechinger wrote:
Ignore him. Adding cruft to your filesystem when you could simply fix
the makefile is a silly suggestion.
Maintaining a site-specific patch to the Makefile temporarily until the project Makefile is changed is more work than just leaving the symlink in place until the project Makefile is changed.
Peace... Sridhar
Hi Sridhar!! :-P
-brian
On 4/11/2012 9:13 AM, hvlems at zonnet.nl wrote:
Sridhar, you are a jolly fellow aren't you ?
Now I thought I understood the way linux uses libraries and yet you
add another mystery Is it because you want to keep me in a perpetual
mystified state of mind?
Hans
:-)
-----Original Message-----
From: Sridhar Ayengar<ploopster at gmail.com>
Sender: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2012 08:52:15
To:<hecnet at Update.UU.SE>
Reply-To: hecnet at Update.UU.SECc: Dave McGuire<mcguire at neurotica.com>
Subject: Re: [HECnet] building simh
Dave McGuire wrote:
Is it possible to explain what the magic does?
More precisely: what is the difference between an .a and an .so
library?
I detailed this a few posts ago. .a is a static library, .so is a
shared library.
How on earth does -lpcap point to /usr/lib?
-lpcap tells the linker to look in every directory in the library
search path to find either libpcap.a or libpcap.so.
This library lives in /usr/lib on most systems, but the simh makefile
hard-coding that path (and hard-coding it to only find the static
library) is a big mistake.
It is, but why not just symlink it for the time being?
Peace... Sridhar
Sure... Try that. You do realize that to do anything SOLAR will have to
go through SG1 then to GORVAX... It will not be pretty (or anything
close to fast). We can give it a try.
If the performance is unacceptable then we will have to make it an area
19 node. Probably not what you had in mind. The alternative is that
you run my DCL procedures on GORVAX and connect the two of them
together, then it won't matter what the area is.
-Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: Sampsa Laine [mailto:sampsa at mac.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2012 11:09
To: Steve Davidson
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Area 44 status
Hmm, could try with L1 and if it doesn't work go for L2..No?
Sampsa
On 11 Apr 2012, at 18:10, Steve Davidson wrote:
You will probably have to make it a router. I'm just not
sure which
one.
-Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: Sampsa Laine [mailto:sampsa at mac.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2012 10:58
To: Steve Davidson
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Area 44 status
Area 8, solar and bonzo.
SOLAR is the VMS box, BONZO is a WinNT4 running Pathworks.
Sampsa
On 11 Apr 2012, at 17:50, Steve Davidson wrote:
Sampsa,
Which DECnet area will they be part of? What will the node
name and
address be?
-Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: Sampsa Laine [mailto:sampsa at mac.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2012 10:42
To: Steve Davidson
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Area 44 status
Steve,
I might need to set up a tunnel from my parents', I'll
register a
DynDNS account for the router..
Crazily enough because we're so far out in the woods a
3G dongle +
external directional antenna is like 2-3 faster and more
stable than
the DSL. The cool thing with Finnish mobile ISPs is that
you get a
real public IP address instead of some NAT'd thing like in
the UK. Of
course the latency is what it is...
My dynamic DNS entry is hilanet.no-ip.org - I need to install
MULTINET on the VMS box though.
Sampsa
On 11 Apr 2012, at 15:23, Steve Davidson wrote:
Only my end does. DCL scripts work GREAT!
-Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
[mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Sampsa Laine
Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2012 03:13
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Area 44 status
Multinet works with dynamic IPs now?
Sampsa
On 11 Apr 2012, at 03:50, Steve Davidson wrote:
Send me your IP address (if static) or domain name (if
dynamic) and I
will create the necessary link for you here. This end is
bridge.declab.net (69.21.253.158).
-Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
[mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of
Brian Hechinger
Sent: Tuesday, April 10, 2012 14:32
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Area 44 status
On 4/10/2012 2:26 PM, Dave McGuire wrote:
On 04/10/2012 02:24 PM, H Vlems wrote:
Thanks to Oleg's suggestion area 44 will be on-line
more often...
Johnny please be so kind to add AR44 (44.1023) to your
database as a
simh VAX3900 running VAX/VMS 6.1?
Woohoo!
If I survive the next two days (really bad deadline at
work) I'll
get back to hacking on tunnels with Brian, and hopefully
Area 61 will
be online shortly thereafter. I plan to run at least one
Alpha DS10L
full-time, and likely a VAX or two as well, and then lots
of other
machines sporadically. (PDP-11/70, DECsystem-2020,
possibly others as
I get them running)
I'd get a multinet tunnel to Steve Davidson first, mainly
as I still
haven't heard back from my ISP and things are going to
get crazy
again for a while here.
-brian
You will probably have to make it a router. I'm just not sure which
one.
-Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: Sampsa Laine [mailto:sampsa at mac.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2012 10:58
To: Steve Davidson
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Area 44 status
Area 8, solar and bonzo.
SOLAR is the VMS box, BONZO is a WinNT4 running Pathworks.
Sampsa
On 11 Apr 2012, at 17:50, Steve Davidson wrote:
Sampsa,
Which DECnet area will they be part of? What will the node
name and
address be?
-Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: Sampsa Laine [mailto:sampsa at mac.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2012 10:42
To: Steve Davidson
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Area 44 status
Steve,
I might need to set up a tunnel from my parents', I'll register a
DynDNS account for the router..
Crazily enough because we're so far out in the woods a 3G dongle +
external directional antenna is like 2-3 faster and more
stable than
the DSL. The cool thing with Finnish mobile ISPs is that you get a
real public IP address instead of some NAT'd thing like in
the UK. Of
course the latency is what it is...
My dynamic DNS entry is hilanet.no-ip.org - I need to install
MULTINET on the VMS box though.
Sampsa
On 11 Apr 2012, at 15:23, Steve Davidson wrote:
Only my end does. DCL scripts work GREAT!
-Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
[mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Sampsa Laine
Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2012 03:13
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Area 44 status
Multinet works with dynamic IPs now?
Sampsa
On 11 Apr 2012, at 03:50, Steve Davidson wrote:
Send me your IP address (if static) or domain name (if
dynamic) and I
will create the necessary link for you here. This end is
bridge.declab.net (69.21.253.158).
-Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
[mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Brian Hechinger
Sent: Tuesday, April 10, 2012 14:32
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Area 44 status
On 4/10/2012 2:26 PM, Dave McGuire wrote:
On 04/10/2012 02:24 PM, H Vlems wrote:
Thanks to Oleg's suggestion area 44 will be on-line
more often...
Johnny please be so kind to add AR44 (44.1023) to your
database as a
simh VAX3900 running VAX/VMS 6.1?
Woohoo!
If I survive the next two days (really bad deadline at
work) I'll
get back to hacking on tunnels with Brian, and hopefully
Area 61 will
be online shortly thereafter. I plan to run at least one
Alpha DS10L
full-time, and likely a VAX or two as well, and then lots
of other
machines sporadically. (PDP-11/70, DECsystem-2020,
possibly others as
I get them running)
I'd get a multinet tunnel to Steve Davidson first, mainly
as I still
haven't heard back from my ISP and things are going to
get crazy
again for a while here.
-brian
Sampsa,
Which DECnet area will they be part of? What will the node name and
address be?
-Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: Sampsa Laine [mailto:sampsa at mac.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2012 10:42
To: Steve Davidson
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Area 44 status
Steve,
I might need to set up a tunnel from my parents', I'll
register a DynDNS account for the router..
Crazily enough because we're so far out in the woods a 3G
dongle + external directional antenna is like 2-3 faster and
more stable than the DSL. The cool thing with Finnish mobile
ISPs is that you get a real public IP address instead of some
NAT'd thing like in the UK. Of course the latency is what it is...
My dynamic DNS entry is hilanet.no-ip.org - I need to install
MULTINET on the VMS box though.
Sampsa
On 11 Apr 2012, at 15:23, Steve Davidson wrote:
Only my end does. DCL scripts work GREAT!
-Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
[mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Sampsa Laine
Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2012 03:13
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Area 44 status
Multinet works with dynamic IPs now?
Sampsa
On 11 Apr 2012, at 03:50, Steve Davidson wrote:
Send me your IP address (if static) or domain name (if
dynamic) and I
will create the necessary link for you here. This end is
bridge.declab.net (69.21.253.158).
-Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
[mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Brian Hechinger
Sent: Tuesday, April 10, 2012 14:32
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: Re: [HECnet] Area 44 status
On 4/10/2012 2:26 PM, Dave McGuire wrote:
On 04/10/2012 02:24 PM, H Vlems wrote:
Thanks to Oleg's suggestion area 44 will be on-line
more often...
Johnny please be so kind to add AR44 (44.1023) to your
database as a
simh VAX3900 running VAX/VMS 6.1?
Woohoo!
If I survive the next two days (really bad deadline at
work) I'll
get back to hacking on tunnels with Brian, and hopefully
Area 61 will
be online shortly thereafter. I plan to run at least one
Alpha DS10L
full-time, and likely a VAX or two as well, and then lots
of other
machines sporadically. (PDP-11/70, DECsystem-2020,
possibly others as
I get them running)
I'd get a multinet tunnel to Steve Davidson first, mainly
as I still
haven't heard back from my ISP and things are going to get crazy
again for a while here.
-brian
The bottomline is that once a change is needed then you must maintain your own documentatiion.
At home my memory for this is perfect.
Hans
PS
For thoise who seriously believe that last statement please contact me for a really good offer on a piece of the Eiffeltower. One previous owner, well cared for....
-----Original Message-----
From: "Steve Davidson" <jeep at scshome.net>
Sender: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2012 09:23:55
To: <hecnet at Update.UU.SE>
Reply-To: hecnet at Update.UU.SESubject: RE: [HECnet] building simh
On the other hand... Adding a soft link (and documenting it - don't ALL
system managers document their system changes???) may be preferred to
changing the makefile because once you change the makefile you OWN its
maintenance. Different strokes for different folks.
-Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
[mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Brian Hechinger
Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2012 09:17
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: Re: [HECnet] building simh
Ignore him. Adding cruft to your filesystem when you could
simply fix the makefile is a silly suggestion.
Hi Sridhar!! :-P
-brian
On 4/11/2012 9:13 AM, hvlems at zonnet.nl wrote:
Sridhar, you are a jolly fellow aren't you ?
Now I thought I understood the way linux uses libraries and
yet you add another mystery Is it because you want to keep
me in a perpetual mystified state of mind?
Hans
:-)
-----Original Message-----
From: Sridhar Ayengar<ploopster at gmail.com>
Sender: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2012 08:52:15
To:<hecnet at Update.UU.SE>
Reply-To: hecnet at Update.UU.SECc: Dave McGuire<mcguire at neurotica.com>
Subject: Re: [HECnet] building simh
Dave McGuire wrote:
Is it possible to explain what the magic does?
More precisely: what is the difference between an .a and
an .so library?
I detailed this a few posts ago. .a is a static
library, .so is
a shared library.
How on earth does -lpcap point to /usr/lib?
-lpcap tells the linker to look in every directory in
the library
search path to find either libpcap.a or libpcap.so.
This library lives in /usr/lib on most systems, but the simh
makefile hard-coding that path (and hard-coding it to only
find the
static
library) is a big mistake.
It is, but why not just symlink it for the time being?
Peace... Sridhar
On the other hand... Adding a soft link (and documenting it - don't ALL
system managers document their system changes???) may be preferred to
changing the makefile because once you change the makefile you OWN its
maintenance. Different strokes for different folks.
-Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
[mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Brian Hechinger
Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2012 09:17
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: Re: [HECnet] building simh
Ignore him. Adding cruft to your filesystem when you could
simply fix the makefile is a silly suggestion.
Hi Sridhar!! :-P
-brian
On 4/11/2012 9:13 AM, hvlems at zonnet.nl wrote:
Sridhar, you are a jolly fellow aren't you ?
Now I thought I understood the way linux uses libraries and
yet you add another mystery Is it because you want to keep
me in a perpetual mystified state of mind?
Hans
:-)
-----Original Message-----
From: Sridhar Ayengar<ploopster at gmail.com>
Sender: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2012 08:52:15
To:<hecnet at Update.UU.SE>
Reply-To: hecnet at Update.UU.SECc: Dave McGuire<mcguire at neurotica.com>
Subject: Re: [HECnet] building simh
Dave McGuire wrote:
Is it possible to explain what the magic does?
More precisely: what is the difference between an .a and
an .so library?
I detailed this a few posts ago. .a is a static
library, .so is
a shared library.
How on earth does -lpcap point to /usr/lib?
-lpcap tells the linker to look in every directory in
the library
search path to find either libpcap.a or libpcap.so.
This library lives in /usr/lib on most systems, but the simh
makefile hard-coding that path (and hard-coding it to only
find the
static
library) is a big mistake.
It is, but why not just symlink it for the time being?
Peace... Sridhar
Ignore him. Adding cruft to your filesystem when you could simply fix the makefile is a silly suggestion.
Hi Sridhar!! :-P
-brian
On 4/11/2012 9:13 AM, hvlems at zonnet.nl wrote:
Sridhar, you are a jolly fellow aren't you ?
Now I thought I understood the way linux uses libraries and yet you add another mystery Is it because you want to keep me in a perpetual mystified state of mind?
Hans
:-)
-----Original Message-----
From: Sridhar Ayengar<ploopster at gmail.com>
Sender: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2012 08:52:15
To:<hecnet at Update.UU.SE>
Reply-To: hecnet at Update.UU.SECc: Dave McGuire<mcguire at neurotica.com>
Subject: Re: [HECnet] building simh
Dave McGuire wrote:
Is it possible to explain what the magic does?
More precisely: what is the difference between an .a and an .so library?
I detailed this a few posts ago. .a is a static library, .so is a
shared library.
How on earth does -lpcap point to /usr/lib?
-lpcap tells the linker to look in every directory in the library
search path to find either libpcap.a or libpcap.so.
This library lives in /usr/lib on most systems, but the simh makefile
hard-coding that path (and hard-coding it to only find the static
library) is a big mistake.
It is, but why not just symlink it for the time being?
Peace... Sridhar
Sridhar, you are a jolly fellow aren't you ?
Now I thought I understood the way linux uses libraries and yet you add another mystery Is it because you want to keep me in a perpetual mystified state of mind?
Hans
:-)
-----Original Message-----
From: Sridhar Ayengar <ploopster at gmail.com>
Sender: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2012 08:52:15
To: <hecnet at Update.UU.SE>
Reply-To: hecnet at Update.UU.SECc: Dave McGuire<mcguire at neurotica.com>
Subject: Re: [HECnet] building simh
Dave McGuire wrote:
Is it possible to explain what the magic does?
More precisely: what is the difference between an .a and an .so library?
I detailed this a few posts ago. .a is a static library, .so is a
shared library.
How on earth does -lpcap point to /usr/lib?
-lpcap tells the linker to look in every directory in the library
search path to find either libpcap.a or libpcap.so.
This library lives in /usr/lib on most systems, but the simh makefile
hard-coding that path (and hard-coding it to only find the static
library) is a big mistake.
It is, but why not just symlink it for the time being?
Peace... Sridhar
