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by HECNET＠beyondthepale.ie

It is triggered by the setting of the todr at boot time. In principle, it picks the mtime of / to get a rough estimate of what time it is at boot time. It's done in inittodr, which is called from ufs_mount. inittodr checks if the date is before 1975, and if it is, the it's preposterous. I've booted both VMS and OSF/1 or Tru64 or Digital Unix or whatever it is called this week on the same Alphaserver 2100. The oses use the TOY clock differently unfortunately. When VMS notices that the time is "preposterous" is prompts me to enter the correct date and time before allowing the machine to boot. Unix gives me the "preposterous" message and advises me to fix the clock later while going on to boot and put "preposterous" dates on various files :-( The VMS approach can also be somewhat inconvenient when trying to do "lights out" operations. A pity that a standard way of using the TOY clock could not have been agreed for all the oses supported on a particular processor. Regards, Peter Coghlan.

13 years, 3 months

SimH, Ultrix and DECnet

by bqt＠softjar.se

On 2012-06-28 12:09, Mark Benson wrote: That's a UNIX tradition I think, lot of UNIXs I have used (IRIX, Solaris, NetBSD to name a few) return the 'preposterous value in Time if Day clock' or similar error if the date wrong. I think it's triggered if the system date is prior to the kernel's date :) It is triggered by the setting of the todr at boot time. In principle, it picks the mtime of / to get a rough estimate of what time it is at boot time. It's done in inittodr, which is called from ufs_mount. inittodr checks if the date is before 1975, and if it is, the it's preposterous. So, a simple way to trigger this error message would be to just set the date to sometime in 1972, shut down the system, and then reboot. The initial time for a booted system should thus always be just following the last time the machine was shut down. This is then updated by the todr, if it exists, and have a valid value. But since the todr only is a running time that covers about 1.5 years, it cannot really tell the full time. But assuming you got it almost right (within 6 months or so), todr can then adjust the rest. The code in current NetBSD is i principle identical to Ultrix, so the same is probably still true for all modern Unixes (I don't know about Linux though). Johnny -- Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: bqt at softjar.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol

13 years, 3 months

SimH, Ultrix and DECnet

by md.benson＠gmail.com

On 28 Jun 2012, at 11:26, Tony Blews <tonyblews at gmail.com> wrote: Ultrix not liking the year 2000 means you need to be preposterous, sadly. Use my strategy and use 1984 - the calendar is the same as 2012 and it was a leap year :) Slightly related: while poking around in the shed looking for a spare kettle lead, I found a shrink-wrapped copy of SCO Unix on 5.25" disks and a copy of the "Unix for VMS Users" book. I've moved house 7 times in the last 20 years. Why do i keep this crap? If I knew the answer to that I wouldn't keep any of it either ;) -- Mark Benson http://markbenson.org/blog http://twitter.com/MDBenson

13 years, 3 months

SimH, Ultrix and DECnet

by tonyblews＠gmail.com

Ultrix not liking the year 2000 means you need to be preposterous, sadly. Slightly related: while poking around in the shed looking for a spare kettle lead, I found a shrink-wrapped copy of SCO Unix on 5.25" disks and a copy of the "Unix for VMS Users" book. I've moved house 7 times in the last 20 years. Why do i keep this crap? On Thu, Jun 28, 2012 at 12:09 PM, Mark Benson <md.benson at gmail.com> wrote: That's a UNIX tradition I think, lot of UNIXs I have used (IRIX, Solaris, NetBSD to name a few) return the 'preposterous value in Time if Day clock' or similar error if the date wrong. I think it's triggered if the system date is prior to the kernel's date :) -- Mark Benson http://markbenson.org/blog http://twitter.com/MDBenson On 28 Jun 2012, at 10:53, Mark Wickens <mark at wickensonline.co.uk> wrote: > On 28/06/12 10:31, Tony Blews wrote: >> Hi. >> >> Has anyone had any success emulating Ultrix with DECnet under SimH? >> I managed to find a copy of 4.0, and the "tape" claimed that it was installing DECnet, but I couldn't find any evidence of it anywhere on the system. >> I may just be being stupid (this is not unknown). >> >> An aside: You've got to love an OS that gives you error messages containing the word "preposterous"! >> >> Tony. > That would be reporting the TOY clock setting then? > > -- > http://www.wickensonline.co.uk > http://declegacy.org.uk >

13 years, 3 months

SimH, Ultrix and DECnet

by tonyblews＠gmail.com

Yeah, '70 was a preposterous year it seems. Most on the 70s were, thinking about it. On Thu, Jun 28, 2012 at 11:53 AM, Mark Wickens <mark at wickensonline.co.uk> wrote: That would be reporting the TOY clock setting then? -- http://www.wickensonline.co.uk http://declegacy.org.uk

13 years, 3 months

SimH, Ultrix and DECnet

by md.benson＠gmail.com

That's a UNIX tradition I think, lot of UNIXs I have used (IRIX, Solaris, NetBSD to name a few) return the 'preposterous value in Time if Day clock' or similar error if the date wrong. I think it's triggered if the system date is prior to the kernel's date :) -- Mark Benson http://markbenson.org/blog http://twitter.com/MDBenson On 28 Jun 2012, at 10:53, Mark Wickens <mark at wickensonline.co.uk> wrote: On 28/06/12 10:31, Tony Blews wrote: Hi. Has anyone had any success emulating Ultrix with DECnet under SimH? I managed to find a copy of 4.0, and the "tape" claimed that it was installing DECnet, but I couldn't find any evidence of it anywhere on the system. I may just be being stupid (this is not unknown). An aside: You've got to love an OS that gives you error messages containing the word "preposterous"! Tony. That would be reporting the TOY clock setting then? -- http://www.wickensonline.co.uk http://declegacy.org.uk

13 years, 3 months

SimH, Ultrix and DECnet

by mark＠wickensonline.co.uk

On 28/06/12 10:31, Tony Blews wrote: Hi. Has anyone had any success emulating Ultrix with DECnet under SimH? I managed to find a copy of 4.0, and the "tape" claimed that it was installing DECnet, but I couldn't find any evidence of it anywhere on the system. I may just be being stupid (this is not unknown). An aside: You've got to love an OS that gives you error messages containing the word "preposterous"! Tony. That would be reporting the TOY clock setting then? -- http://www.wickensonline.co.uk http://declegacy.org.uk

13 years, 3 months

SimH, Ultrix and DECnet

by tonyblews＠gmail.com

Hi. Has anyone had any success emulating Ultrix with DECnet under SimH? I managed to find a copy of 4.0, and the "tape" claimed that it was installing DECnet, but I couldn't find any evidence of it anywhere on the system. I may just be being stupid (this is not unknown). An aside: You've got to love an OS that gives you error messages containing the word "preposterous"! Tony.

13 years, 3 months

VAXstation 3100 boot - now you see it, now you don't...

by HECNET＠beyondthepale.ie

The m38 gets to '...B' in the countdown and then restarts with the graphics test ad infinitum. The m30 gets to '...B' in the countdown and then hangs. The countdown includes a question mark after the initial 'F?' The good news is I've seen something like this. The bad news is it was caused by leakage from the battery pack. The batteries in these machines are very old now and I would suggest removing them and recycling them whether they are leaking or not. If they are not leaking now, they are going to start soon. Suitable replacements can sometimes be found intended for use with cordless phones. The machine can be also be left without a battery pack although it will not remember it's boot settings and will need the time to be reset every time it is turned on. Test B is the memory test. Try removing the memory expansion board and check if the test completes then. Check the expansion board and the main board for corrosion damage. I think test F relates to the monochrome graphics system. I've got to run now but I can dig up more information later if nobody else chimes in before I return. Regards, Peter Coghlan.

13 years, 3 months

Possible downtime

by pontus＠update.uu.se

On 06/26/2012 10:06 PM, Pontus wrote: On 06/15/2012 03:36 PM, Pontus Pihlgren wrote: Mim and the server running this mailinglist might have to be taken down. I'll get back to you when I know more. I just found out (five minutes ago) that our hard working admins are moving hardware out of the water damaged room. Psilo and Mim will go down soon. I can't say for how long, looks like it might be a while. Short update: Psilo is back and running in a temporary setting. There will be more downtime when we can move hardware back into the server room. Mim is still down. Regards, Pontus.

13 years, 3 months

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